Tom, Agreed. As long as I record the CCS Data on the blanks I start with, I can replicate the desired effect with subsequent finished rods even though I alter the lengths. I then re-measure the CCS data, but I eliminate the grip length factor and use the reel seat to tip as the common denominator. I admit, this probably would not be advisable for “two handed” rods because the loading dynamic
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Tom, I agree with what you’re saying, but I’m normally concerned with CCS/AA measurements at the end product (finished rod). Even if I had a CCS for a given blank, it would change because I almost always shorten the butt end and sometimes the tip to achieve what I’m looking for. By using the known measurements (CCS data) of my other rods, I can usually adjust as needed to get what I wantâ
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Emory, You’re probably right. Basing the “formulas” or “rules of thumb” where it would apply to most situations does make sense. For “my” type of rods I’d probably benefit from the reel seat to tip effective length for CCS and AA comparative measurements (only against MY other rods). If I used the “accepted” formula of “total” length, there would be a significant differen
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After many years of building rods, there is still something that I’ve found to be elusive if not confusing. Several of the “rule of thumb” formulas used in rod building are based on rod “length”. I.E. “number of guides”, “CCS” loading, “Action Angle”, Lure Rating, etc. Almost all of my (Bass) rods utilize a five to seven inch grip length and I’ve always considered the g
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Duane, I agree with some of the advantages you’ve listed, but a longer rod (reel to tip) does not offer “mechanical advantage” or better leverage to the fisherman. He (or she) is at the short end of a lever arm and the ratio is not in his favor. Some of the mechanical advantage can be regained by increasing the rod length behind the reel seat, decreasing the ratio.
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As we all know, many of a rods attributes are trade offs. Flipping sticks (as well as other types of rods) can benefit from long lengths, but that length can also be a liability. The longer a rod gets, the more mechanical DISADVANTAGE for the fisherman, plus, the rod gets tip heavy. This can be offset to some degree by adding length and weight to the grip. The amount of weight needed to balance t
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Many years ago when I was young and inexperienced I really enjoyed fishing even though my equipment was not very good. At the time, it certainly seemed adequate and I caught a lot of fish. An old saying comes to mind……”Happiness is not being smart enough to know what to worry about.” I don’t know that I may be obsessed with weight in the rods that I build, but for me it is a major co
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Stan, Thanks for the chart. VERY helpful. I've been using Quantum's "Hot Sauce" which is relatively low viscosity, but I see on the chart that Rem Oil (which I have) is even lower. I might give it a try.
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There has been several posts recently regarding casting distance and I have a related question. I’ve had problems on occasion with oil in reel bearings inhibiting casting distance. Not in the sense of distance per se, but ease of casting. I’ve tried different oils, but they all seem to inhibit, to some degree, the free rotation of the (spool) bearings. Removing the oil completely solves the p
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Emory, I’m looking forward to seeing the next article on SENSITIVITY that you and Mike are collaborating on. I hope that you will include rod length as one of the factors affecting sensitivity.
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Emory, Your revelation speaks volumes for your character! KUDO’S to you.
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I think from the number of views on this subject that there is a tremendous amount of interest in how rod characteristics affect “sensitivity”. Although the arguments have been thought provoking and stimulating, they don’t seem to me to be conclusive. I’m hoping that someone will do some comprehensive testing and provide us with quantitive results. It would be great to have the tests in
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Mike, I think you're providing a very valuable service to many of us. I wish someone had done this years ago. I'll certainly "bookmark" your site for future reference. You're providing us a means to input data that will be useful to us all. I think you're efforts are very much appreciated.
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Stephen, Aside from the make and style of guide, if you can measure the inside diameter of the guide you're looking to replace, using calipers or by trying drill sizes for a best fit, I can give you the comparable ring size (in Fuji). The style or type and the material (hardloy, Alconite, ti) may be pertinent.
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Several months ago I rebuilt a rod by removing 4 Fuji double foot (SVSG 6, 6, 8, 10) guides and replaced them with 6 RECOILS (RSPG sgl foot 6, 6, 6, 6, 8, 10). The weight savings was 2.27 grams. That is the accumulative weight differential of the lighter guides, less thread and epoxy. Because of WHERE the weight was removed there is a VERY noticeable difference in the way the rod performs.
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Robert, I assume you’re still talking about guide weights. Are you saying “Well doesn't seem like it is worth the effort”? I personally think it would be a valuable resource to have guides weights as well as other rod components available to rodbuilders. I’ve compiled a spec sheet for my own use and it has proved to be invaluable to me as a reference. I know there are those that think
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Emory, I’ve been doing some more thinking about the low/high frequency thing and it seems to me that in a “low” frequency situation, a “shorter” rod would have slight “sensitivity” advantages over a longer one. I.E. a 5’ 6” vs. a 7’ 6”. Of course rod length is dictated by the type of fishing it was built for, but the adherent sensitivity could be an advantageous by-product
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At our age, prunes is a good thing.
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Emory, What you said…. “whether a stiffer rod or less stiff rod is more sensitive is somewhat a function of the input frequency or dv/dt”…, makes sense to me. I think the higher frequencies such as a “strike” or a “pickup” would be slightly better transmitted through the lighter rod with less mechanical impedance. It would also hold true with “vibrating” type baits as well,
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Mike, You said “You are on the right track here, but I can tell you with great confidence that unless you did not know which rod you held each time, you could not be as objective as you think.” Actually, to some extent, I did NOT know which rods I tested each time because most of my rods look very similar. (The two Rainshadows look identical). Until I later (after testing) checked the rod
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Mike, I apologize for the discrepancy, but the weight of the rod with the “fast tip” is 3.03, not 3.3. The other being 3.01 ounce makes it less than .007% difference. (.02 ounce) Also, the one that I cut off the tip was 1 ¾ ,not 1 ½, for what its worth. Another error I’ve found when I checked my spec sheet is that one of the Loomis rods (Ref CCS 276) is a #C723 Med Hvy, but both the Loo
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Mike, While I tend to agree with your logic, my test seems to validate Emory’s argument. The two Rainshadow blanks are almost identical. The same blank, except one has the “fast tip” removed. The slight weight differential is probably the extra 1 ½” of butt length to compensate for the tip length that was cut off. This has been a revelation for me because I’ve also believed that the
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Sorry about the clarity of the "scores". The actual post doesn't translate exactly as typed. I added a slash between the "hvy" and "light" which might help. 7 /5 Rainshadow RX8+C742 5’ 8” OAL CCS 200 A/A 70 deg. 3.3 oz tot wt. 5 /1 Rainshadow RX8+C742 5’ 8” OAL CCS 235 A/A 65 deg 3.01 oz wt. (1 ½” of “fast tip” removed) 5 /
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My “test” was conducted by anchoring the end of 60 feet of Sufix braided line and having the subject rod/reel at the opposite end. Two “tapping devices” were used, located close to the anchor point. One of the devices was a plastic tie strip stapled to a board. It was located so as to tap the line when released from a vertical position. The second much lighter “tapper” was a red plast
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In an effort to prevent falling asleep while reading all the scientific dissertations, I figured I’d go out in the back yard and do some testing. Obviously the “test” that I performed was not in a lab environment nor was there any sophisticated equipment used. The results of my “tests”, which I’ll explain in greater detail in another post, have not proven any of you wrong, but they se
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Bill, Your question about “which rod characteristics transmits this the best?” is a profound one. Many of us who thought we knew are now in doubt. Your scenario is one of many where “sensitivity” is an issue. I recall years ago seeing a video of a bass inhaling a crankbait and expelling it seconds later. When the photographer/diver asked why the fisherman didn’t set the hook, the guy
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It seems to me that it wouldn’t be too hard to come up with a test to compare relative sensitivity for “stiff” vs. “soft” rods. It could be similar to a hearing test, except the “subject fisherman” would be asked to signal when he FEELS a signal. If he (or she) was blindfolded and not aware whether he held the "stiff" or "soft" rod and a series of “controlledâ
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I think what we’re dealing with here is a “reverse engineering” situation. Sensitivity or “feel” (or any other rod attribute) can and probably should be looked at as the final “product”. How we get there can be hypothesized to death, but you can only do so much “engineering” and then you need to build a prototype to prove out the theories through trial and error (comprehensive t
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Mike, I hope that I’m wrong about admitting that I’ve been wrong. I’m inclined to agree with your logic, but I know that sometimes if you do (or believe) something “wrong” long enough, it becomes “right”. I have a lot of respect for Tom and Emory’s knowledge, but it’s hard for me to let go of my shock absorber theory. (I’ve believed it for a long time) It seems to me tha
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Emory, If you pursue this, I wouldn't use cooked noodles.
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