Can anyone provide weights of guides on the Blue Zirconium / TiCh (gunsmoke) for comparison?
There are some differences in costs but weight make tip the balance in many people's minds.

American Tackle Blue Zirconium guides
Batson Blue Zirconium guides?

Thank you
Robert

Actually, I beg to differ.

The issue of guide weights is relevant mostly when the customer insists on the lightest rod possible, for whatever reason. Designs that go in that direction include skeleton grips, skeleton reel seats, no foregrip, and maybe even wire-frame guides. If you want to take it to the extreme, then add "no thread wraps" to the list. Otherwise, light is a relative term.

If you want to compare American Tackle "Blue" guides with the Batsons, though, at least you're comparing apples-to-apples, assuming everything else on the rod is exactly equal. But there's no way I'd bet that a customer with his eyes closed could tell the difference to a rod made with a set of the one, and a rod made with a set of the other, Most customers, when they first pick up one of our rods, comment on how light it feels. Compared to what? Well, we don't know, but whatever it is, we distinguish our rods with their light weight and balance, campared to whatever the customer has experienced, and really, we don't normally worry about whatever he might have seen before. The real question is, does he find our build favorable by comparison. If so, we have one of the "yes's" we need to make the sale.

I'd venture to say that if the customer held one set of each of the two brands you listed above in his hands, he couldn't tell the difference. However, the different frame designs might change the way the rod works after you build it. That change might get his attention.

Let's reverse the question - how heavy is heavy? Ask a saltwater fly guy, and then ask a saltwater tuna guy. If you want to have some more fun, ask your customer to compare matched sets of AFTCO roller guides with some other brand. See, in tuna fishing, strong is king. So what's my point? Well, except as a nice factoid or point for discussion around a table sometime, I think other things - like the super look of a rod finished with the Blue guides - will make the sale most every time.

I'm probably wrong. But that's just a normal condition for me.

Uncle Russ
Calico Creek Rods

I'm with you, Russ!!!! People agonize over which one weighs 3 grains less when it can't be felt anyways.

Mike (Southgate, MI)
If I don't want to, I don't have to and nobody can make me (except my wife) cuz I'm RETIRED!!

I too have never really bought into the weight of a guide argument. The minor weight differences, for fly rods, is so small that even if you were casting for 8 hours straight with 2 rods of different weights you would not be able to tell the difference. And you would tire at the same rate with either rod.

But then again what do I know I havent built a rod in over 2 years hahahaha

Regards

Scott

Russ, Mike Scott,
I agree with you that if you held the rod stationary that a small difference in the weight of the guides would be hard to detect. But when you put that rod into motion you can detect it. The reason being that the increase in the inertia that results from a small increase in weight, mass actually, can be large. This is because the inertia is a function of the mass and the velocity.
To prove this to yourself take a rod and shake it so as to make the tip move back and forth a couple of feet and see how it feels. Now tape an extra guide on the rod at the tip and shake it again. You will be able to feel a significant difference.
You will not be able to feel this small added weight if it is added near the butt of the rod where the velocity is low and the rod has more mass but I will bet a nickle that you will be able to feel a very small added weight at the tip of the rod. Try it and see if you do not agree.
Also by taping this extra guide on the rod you have lowered the resonant frequency of the rod and now it will not be as responsive, will be less sensitive and will not cast as far or will take more effort to cast a given distance.

Several months ago I rebuilt a rod by removing 4 Fuji double foot (SVSG 6, 6, 8, 10) guides and replaced them with 6 RECOILS (RSPG sgl foot 6, 6, 6, 6, 8, 10). The weight savings was 2.27 grams. That is the accumulative weight differential of the lighter guides, less thread and epoxy. Because of WHERE the weight was removed there is a VERY noticeable difference in the way the rod performs.