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PC7 vs PC12
Posted by: Ralph Tomaccio (---.ipt.aol.com)
Date: September 18, 2005 12:10AM

I was in Home Depot today looking at their adhesives and noticed that the same company that makes PC7 also makes a PC12 which is labeled as their "Marine" version of PC7.

Has anyone tried PC12? Being oriented towards marine use, I would guess that it might be appropriate for rod building as well since reel seats get dunked frequently while releasing fish, rain, etc..

Any thoughts on this? Good, bad, otherwise?

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Re: PC7 vs PC12
Posted by: Anonymous User (Moderator)
Date: September 18, 2005 08:45AM

Neither are good products for rod building. These are heavy paste type epoxies and if your parts fit as they should, these thick pastes will have no room in your joint - they'll just be pushed out. Neither do they lubricate parts to enable a smooth slip fit.

In some situations, where you may need to fill a gap, they would be the correct adhesive for the job. But in most rod building situations, PC& or 12 are among the poorest epoxies you could possibly choose. They are simply not the correct type product for the type of assemblies we typically bond in rod building.

................................

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Re: PC7 vs PC12
Posted by: Lou Reyna (---.hr.hr.cox.net)
Date: September 18, 2005 10:05AM

Ditto on what Tom already said.

Use Rod Bond or Kardol paste epoxies.

Lou

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Re: PC7 vs PC12
Posted by: Cliff Hall (---.dialup.ufl.edu)
Date: September 18, 2005 03:01PM

Here are some good Message Threads found by the SEARCH Engine from the RBO Archives on the subject of PC7 / PC-7 Paste Epoxy. What Tom Kirkman and Lou Reyna have said above essentially still stands. These citations below provide even more comments to round out the explanations, the overall discussion and back up these statements. -CMH.

If a situation calls for a non-flowing, space-filling adhesive of stiff mechanical strength when cured (even threadable), PC7 / PC-7 Paste Epoxy COULD be considered. It will not wet or penetrate into a substrate because of its high viscosity. BUT most builders who have used both would prefer ROD-BOND.

"PC-7 Past" (BB meant "Paste")
[www.rodbuilding.org]
Posted by: bill boettcher Date: January 14, 2004 06:24PM
"has any one used this stuff for real seets and handles??
Thanks for any info" - bill boettcher

"PC-7 vs. U-40 Rod Bond"
[www.rodbuilding.org]
Posted by: Buddy Tison Date: April 24, 2002 02:46PM
"Would like opinions of using Rod Bond in place of PC-7 on heavy rods. (80-130# ) Have the results of the Rod Bond been satisfactory for seats and gimbals.?" - Buddy Tison

Re: PC-7 vs. U-40 Rod Bond
Posted by: Mike Ballard Date: April 24, 2002 10:43PM
"I have used PC7 on many butt ferrules from Aftco in the past 15 years. But no more. I get a better fit and hit it with the Rod Bond. Seems to stay in the joint better and is just all around easier to work with. I wouldn't say PC7 is bad or shouldn't be used, just that Rod Bond can substitute for it any day and is just as strong and less fussy to work with."

"What to use to take up space in the gaps of the unibutt ferrule"
[www.rodbuilding.org]
Posted by: Al Johnson Date: July 15, 2005 05:19PM
"What do you guys use to take up space between the blank and the unibutt ferrule? Rigging floss? Thread?" - Al Johnson

"unibutt ferrule installation blooper"
[www.rodbuilding.org]
Ricardo Font June 29, 2005 09:56
"I finished a 50# stand-up rod, when I mounted the reel and the unibutt, and lay it on the floor, I noticed a misalignment of the guides of about 3 degrees to the left from the centerline of the reel and the unibutt, looking at the assembly from the top. The guides are straight, its an obvious error when I installed the ferrule (I used PC7). This will not happen again, since I decided to leave the ferrule installation and alignment process for the end, with everything else mounted, including the reel.But now, what are my options to fix this blooper? Thanks to all!"

"Epoxy for grip and reel seat"
Pat Ryan Jan. 31, 2005 08:05
[www.rodbuilding.org]
"Is it OK to use 5 minute epoxy to attach your grip and reel seat? What I have is your basic stuff from the hardware store. It says it is water resistant, is this going to be durable enough over the life of the rod?" - Pat Ryan

Re: Flex Coat arbors/masking/drywall tape, etc
Posted by: William Colby Date: November 25, 2004 09:54PM
[www.rodbuilding.org]
"No, from what we've learned epoxy is meant to adhere our parts not to be used as solid bushings. It's heavy and there are much lighter materials that can be used as bushings. I guess there are some gap filling epoxies that can be used for that sort of thing like PC7 but that makes for some pretty heavy bushings. The thing about the Flex Coat arbors is that they're so light and so inexpensive that taking time to cut them in half or thirds just isn't necessary. I use them full length just to make a quicker job of the whole process. And those who are saying that you can mount a seat with them in mere minutes aren't kidding." - Wm. Colby

Gimbal Installation
Posted by: Mark Gordon Date: June 15, 2004 01:02PM
[www.rodbuilding.org]
"... I tried to install a gimbal but, I'm having some difficulty. ... I wrapped the blank with fiberglass drywall tape, leaving room between the grip and tape so epoxy could settle into the void. I then wet the inside of the gimbal and the blank, tape, etc. with PC7. ... The setup never stabilized -- the epoxy set, but I was able to pull the gimbal off the blank with my hand. It appears the epoxy didn't wet the fiberglass tape enough to hold it in place." - Mark Gordon.

Re: Graphite Bushings / PC-11 C/U
Posted by: Cliff Hall Date: September 16, 2004 11:29AM
[www.rodbuilding.org]
"... 70% IsoPropyl Alcohol - works very well for clean-up on components & tools (used with PC-7). Also, a few drops (10-20) of IPA-70 can be added during the mixing stage of PC-7 to reduce the viscosity of this paste somewhat or refresh a slightly dried-out batch of part A or B. Mixing should be done with a spatula on a non-absorbing surface, like a clean glass plate or heavy duty aluminum foil. I suspect you'll find that 70%-IPA works for PC-11, too. -Cliff Hall+++

Re: PC-11
Posted by: Tom Kirkman Date: August 14, 2003 09:28AM
[www.rodbuilding.org]
The heavy paste epoxies are good, but not well suited to most rod building tasks. Liquid epoxies or a gel type such as Rod Bond are easier to work with and provide similar strength.

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Re: PC7 vs PC12
Posted by: Ralph Tomaccio (---.ipt.aol.com)
Date: September 18, 2005 03:43PM

Thank you all for your replies, and a special thank you to Cliff for digging up all those links for me. I have been educated!

I have not yet built a rod and am in the "pre-build" stage of acquiring knowledge and answering questions to help me decide what to order and minimize problems during the build. Without a doubt, Rodbond is the choice of pros and, thus, what I will use as well.

In some of those links I read about different types of arbors. Now, I am wondering what the current preferred trend is for them - masking tape still adequate? Fiberglass mesh drywall tape? Graphite arbors?

My first rod will be a 7'6" 3 weight if that info makes any difference as to what's best to use.

Thanks again!

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Re: PC7 vs PC12
Posted by: Cliff Hall (---.dialup.ufl.edu)
Date: September 18, 2005 05:52PM

Ralph Tomaccio - You'll do better to start a new Thread for that question. The preview is that masking tape may be convenient, but also has about the highest frequency of causes for repair. Real FlexCoat or graphite arbors are probably your first choice. Thread or cord bushings would get mixed reviews / recommendations. Do a SEARCH = ARBOR or TAPE and see what you get. Then Post a new question to refine to your situation. LOL, -Cliff Hall+++

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