20 rpm. Like I said, I know it must be me. I can put the finish on super quick if needed no problem there. And very quickly even it out by eye. But then it doesn't do it's magical thing like liquid should do! It flows a little and teases me like it's going to smooth out and level but then it doesnt. It just gets to a point where it won't level on itself after a few minutes. I know if you apply it somewhat lightly and somwhat even, the it should do it's thing on it's own. not in my case. I swear i am leaving it alone. the only time I am not is when I try a different method. You should all buy stock in epoxy companies based on how much I am buying and practicing with.

Donald Becker Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Check the ends of your guide wraps. If the epoxy
> does not flow nicely onto the blank, you blank may
> be contaminated.


I have no problem with guide wraps. I may or may not wrap the ends of the decal area or include the hook kepper wrap in this area. No thread issues, no guide issues. only long section of 3 inches or more of epoxy. Wether the ends are wrapped or not doesn't make a diff. I get the same result wether its a long section that is wrapped alll the way, at the ends or not at all. wavy wavy wavy

What finish ??I also don't like the temps of the room I like Cooler temps - not cold but cool helps finish to flow

Even at that temps some thing is wrong here ????

if you mix your finish and then POOR in on a flat surface Does it level -- It Should

get some scrap blanks and mix and apply your finish Some thin is not Cohere here ???

Bill - willierods.com



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 05/08/2013 02:45PM by bill boettcher.

Of course it does! You and Tom already know the answer. And I do pour it out on foil. I feel like a fool
FC lite or high same result with both. This morning it was cooler 67 degrees and guess what. Yep, wavy wavy wavy

My rod is level, my axis spin is on point and not flopping.
The best way to describe it is this> It flows and starts to level on its own for a few min. then just desides "I'm done flowing and I will sit right here and not level out any more for you". like my pot life is just minutes. I know this is not the case. I can go do 13 guide wraps after this area if I wanted too, so there is more pot life!

All I can say is get some scrap and do the same thing Apply finish and Experiment to find out what is going on

Maybe all you need is a block sanding and a THIN coat ?????

Bill - willierods.com

Nathan, I can only speak of my own experience. I have been finding that I wasn't applying enough finish on the rod to level out on the first coat. If you're trying to apply a light coat that may be part of the problem, I also use heat to get the finish to flow better. Once you start out with a wave in the first coat any following coats will only magnify the problem unless you sand it and re-coat. One other thing are your decals self-adhesive or wet and stick?

Nathan,
Actually, I think that the real pot life for a lot of rod finish is only 3 minutes.

So, that means, mix up, apply finish to the butt area and decal area of the blank first.

Get the finish on the blank in the first 15 seconds. Only mix for 2 minutes, so that the finish is not sitting in the mixing pot for any time at all after mixing.

Basically, when you do this, the viscosity of the finish will be near that of water. If the finish is not that thin, it is not going to level well.

I use flex coat high build and find that a freshly mixed batch levels just fine. But I simply take a plastic cup, mix for 120 seconds and at 130 seconds, the finish is on the butt section of the rod and leveling.

I don't do any transfer from a cup to foil, or waste any time for the finish to sit around in a mixing cup.

I really find no reason to mix in anything other than a plastic cup and find no need to put the finish on a flat or foil surface. But, if I do find that the finish starts to thicken as I get close to the end of a rod, or on a 2nd or 3rd rod from the same mix, I do use a touch of gentle heat, to keep the mix as thin as needed.

I am getting closer- I just did another practice run of FC high build 5 min under a heat lamp, warm to the touch, mix for 3 min, applied length wise, just a small amount of heat from my embossing tool. (like a heat gun but with a lighter fan and less heat, used by seamstresses) wicked of a little sag while turning at 20 rpm. A better result for sure, but not perfect by any means. little wavy still. enough where i would not feel cofartable putting a decal over. I just dont get it. I am applying it as even as possible.

I sit here and watch it turn.....................an still after a couple min it just stops leveling. I can see the very small high/low areas. you would think it being LIQUID it would just smooooooooooooooooth itself right over..

have you tried applying it by hand turning instead of under power? i get a wavy finish when i do it under power and when i start hand turning while applying it went on better and no wavy...also i stopped using a power rod drier for the same reason and now i put it on thin and hand turn it for an hour or 2 hours while i watch tv and it turns out nice

also i figure if you let it on a drier right away i figure gravity wont help...i think of it like if you take syrup and put a glob of it on a spoon and spin it real fast it will still be a glob on a spoon lol but if you turn it and let it sit a min then turn it again it levels and covers the whole spoon

i dont know if thats accurate for epoxy but it sounded pretty good lol

I too had a learning curve while trying to get a good finish job. I read the article in the library over and over and it just would not work for me. I see you just posted 'wicked of a little sag while turning at 20 rpm'. I always cover my decal areas and make sure no dry areas are left. If a sag starts I remove it. I may turn it by hand a couple of times to make sure it is evenly distributed around the blank or continue applying to the guides and checking back to make sure there are no sags about to drip off, if so, they are removed. Before going much further I will let the rod sit without turning for a couple of minutes and evenly wick away the excess from the bottom. Before I turn it again I let it sit for a minute or so to let the finish fill in the voids I created by wicking away. After all is done, I turn on the 18 rpm drier and check it a couple of times before the finish sets up to make sure no fisheyes have formed.

I never worry about "applying even" as you say, it is impossible for me I think., I try to wick off as even as possible while letting the blank sit and the finish flow. If you are wicking while the blank is turning, that could be your problem. I am by no means as experienced as most of these guys but this has worked great for me.

I hope this helps. You might want to check out youtube for tutorials.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 05/08/2013 05:30PM by Scott Armstrong.

That is interesting................ My next batch is to apply while hand turning! Yes I have been applying under 20 RPM, And yes I have been wicking away epoxy under power also.
This could definately be a problem. It seems it never ever ever fills in the voids If I wick off any excess epoxy. And here we are>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> trying to figure out what I am doing to it that makes it happen!
I am doing somthing that is causing this problem. It can't be this complicated.

Yes I agree. That article is GREAT! But you kow what?, It doesn't work for me!

Nathan,
Try again, but with a difference.
Apply the finish at 20 rpm.
But as soon as the finish is applied, slow the rpm to 6 rpm and leave it there.

If the rod continues to spin at 20 rpm, the finish will not level as well as if the rod were turning slower.

to be sure, HAVE a dryer with a motor that actually turns at 6 rpm. I think you might be surprised at the results.

Put a piece of tape on your dryer chuck, and actually count the dryer rpms by the clock. i.e. how many revolutions the chuck turns in 60 seconds.

If you haven't done this, you might find that the chuck is actually turning at a rather different rpm.

I bet the wicking away while turning could be the problem then. I do most of my applying only turning by hand and turn on the drier when all is applied, the excess removed and mostly level.

Thanks Roger,
I thought a slower dryer might help it level better. All I have at this point is a 20 rpm. I just set a timer and my dryer is turning at 19rpm

You're pre-warming it too much.

Nathan,
If you would like, I have an extra 6 rpm motor that I could send to you.

Just drop me an e-mail.

Roger

hflier@comcast.net

I only pre warmed it that one time as a practice session.

roger wilson Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Nathan,
> If you would like, I have an extra 6 rpm motor
> that I could send to you.
>
> Just drop me an e-mail.
>
> Roger
>
> hflier@comcast.net

Thats very generous of you!