What are the rules for using braided lines? I have been told that the braided line should be a higher test rating than the mono top shot put on. is the braided line weaker than the stated test? and is there a reason why I can not use the braided line all the way to the hook.
I plan to use it for botom fishing using real bait.

I think what your asking is. Do I need to use a leader with braided line? Also is Braid weeker than Mono?

I almost always use a fluorocarbon leader with braid . I use it primarily for jig and finesse type fishing. Braid sticks out like a sore thumb in the water,, thats why the leader. Braid has it's pound test on the package , the diameter is smaller than mono of the same pound test.

Hope this is what you were asking
Bill

to add to Bill's reply, some recomend putting some mono on spool first then tie it to your braid, some say the braid may tend to slip on spool. Also on a spinning reel a full spool casts better, braid is smaller dia. per lbs. test then mono, so back it up first with mono so the braid will come to outter edge of spool and cast well.
I like it , I use braid from , ANDE, POWERPRO, & BERKLEY

Dave von Doehren
PRRODS......If man built it , man can fix it.and if man built it man can break it !

As far as braid straight to the hook, I’ve seen guys do it, BUT, I've never seen them catch anything! Bill pretty much nailed it with the visibility issue.

We sell & wind a lot of Spectra and most of our customers use a 75-100yard mono topshot. Their reasoning varies between two main factors, which are the lack of stretch in the Spectra, and the fact that the mono topshot can act as a shock absorber, and that the mono isn't as tough on their guides. Clean Spectra ISN'T hard on guides, but it can get dirty and hold particles that are actually abrasive passing through the guides. Not an issue on SIC, Nitride & other hard ceramics, but it can be on Aluminum Oxide guides and some of the other ceramics.

As Bill mentioned, you can run Spectra with a Fluoro leader too. That's a pretty common set-up for both bottom fishing as well as trolling.

To add to the post above, we normally put a layer of "Flex Wrap" on the spool to prevent the Spectra from spinning on the spool. Flex Wrap is sold at most Costal Tackle Shops for wrapping your fingers to prevent spool/line burn when offshore fishing.


Mark Griffin
[]
C&M Custom Tackle
San Dimas, California



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 01/10/2007 07:33PM by Mark Griffin.

I fish braid all summer long for halibut, and a weaker mono leader is a must. Halibut are in no way leader shy, but when you get hung up on the bottom with 80 pound braid for a leader....no fun at all. If you have to break it off, you can end up losing hundreds of feet of expensive line.

Jeremy,


First give this a read: [duanerichards.proboards23.com]

It will answer many questions about superlines and put to pass some of the hogwash that is so common on the uninformed internet today (yes I do "Pro Staff" for Power Pro braided spectra fishing lines)

1. There are NO rules when using Spectra-this is the most common fiber used for superlines today.
2. Braided lines are typically used in higher pound tests than is actually needed for several reasons:

spectra is so thin that using a higher lb test gives you better handling with a closer diameter to the lines you are use to using

being so thin spectra lacks the abraision resistance that the thicker lb test monofilaments have

you can "get away" with using a higher lb test in spectra due to it's thinness

on some baitcasting reels the thin line can slip down around the reels spool and cause minor problems


3. There is NO REASON WHY you cannot use Spectra tied directly TO ANY lure. NONE. I fish for bass this way 100% of the time, yes even in gin clear waters (Mark, how many pictures would you like? would 100 do? LOL)
4. Bottom fishing with live bait is perfect for using superlines tied DIRECT.
5. The best all around lb test for superlines in freshwater fishing is 6/20lb test. You can use 8/1lb for panfsh and it is perfect for that, the 2/10lb test I just have no use for what so ever. If you fish in rocky rough areas that are normally hard on lines, you may concider 8/30lb test for freshwater fishing. Of course, use AT LEAST the PROPER pound test spectra for the species you are seeking ALWAYS.

However, some species of fish are line shy and you can "up" your catches with these species by using a fluorocarbon or mono leader. Bass is NOT one of them in m y opinion, Striped Bass and Trout seem to be two that are somewhat line shy. What I need to know is the species of fish you are seeking, with this I can better offer a proper suggestion on your leader use, or no use.

Feel free to contact me directly at drcrwr@yahoo.com and I'll be happy to help you make the right decisions on your targeted species and presentaions.

DR




Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 01/10/2007 07:54PM by Duane Richards (DR).

Duane,

How long does it take for Spectra (any test) to break down in regular fresh water? I'm guessing a really really long time. That's why most folks I know use a weaker leader so that they do not leave the stuff in the rivers and lakes when they hang up. Not a knock on PP. . .I love the stuff. . .just food for thought,

Brian

I didn't say it wasn't possible, I just said I've never seen it happen! Most of those that I've seen try it are throwing Iron for Yellowtail in water with good visibility. What I posted was simply a general consensus from our walk in Spectra customers which are 90+% saltwater Fishermen. In fact 30lb is our smallest diameter and 65 & 80 are our best sellers. BIG difference from 12lb!

Mark Griffin
[]
C&M Custom Tackle
San Dimas, California



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 01/10/2007 08:43PM by Mark Griffin.

The major complaint I have agenst spectra line is it want to bury its self in between inbetween its self on a revolving spool. One thing I do know is sense there is no streach. Your hook set dose not have to be as strong
Good Wraps Bob

I have been very satisfied with the J-knot for connecting the mono (regular or flourocarbon mono) to the braided line. I have tried several types of knots for this use, but they all had problems except for the J-knot. The knot is typically shown performing 3 loops for the completed knot. I usually do it with 5 loops.
LF

Brian,

The time it takes Spectra OR Monofilament to "break down" depends on so many issues that it would take a team of scientists weeks to study. But the facts are NEITHER break down well at all, and way more nylon is lost per season due to it propertie's and ease of breakages than spectra.....hard to say what the stats are...

Let me talk to the makers and get back to ya, maybe they can answer this question WAY better than I. Wont take long......

DR

65 and 80 is what i use on most of my rods...i dont need the line stretch from mono because thats what my reel drag is for

for fresh water fishing i dont use a leader but saltwater fishing i use a mono leader (lb test depending on what im going after...example: if im on the flats going for cudas ill use a 40lb leader because of the teeth and for bottom fishing ill use a 80lb leader because i wont have to change leaders every cast from it getting tore up)

it all depends on what type of fishing you are doing and what the conditions are

One area that hasn't been discussed is most big game fly fisherman use spectra as backing on their reels. By using the spectra they can double the line capacity of the reel in doing so they also improve the retrieval rate. As an example an Abel Super 14 is listed as holding 500 yards of 30# test dacron plus a 14 wt flyline. If spectra is used the reel will hold 300 yards of 30# dacron plus 600 yards of 50# test spectra and a 15wt Billy Pate Billfish line or if 80# test spectra is used it will hold about 800 yards plus the flyline. AS far as durability is concerned I've used the same spectra backing on an Abel 3N since 1993 this reel has caught bonefish by the 1000's and false albacore by the 1000's and it still looks brand new. I only remove the backing one time a year and soak it in warm water with a little baby shampoo added, let it dry out then store it out of direct sunlight. A word to the wise spectra line does not absorb water, dacron does, if dacron is used next to the arbor of the reel do not store the reel for extended periods of time with the line on the reel or the reel spool will corrode wherever the dacron is located

I agree with DR on this one. I use Power Pro and Fireline on my bass rods. I started using white braid (got it free at a garage sale) and tried it on dock skipping rods with albino superflukes and green senko imitations all last year. I could not tell any difference between white braid, green Power Pro, or mono as far as catching fish is concerned (and I caught hundreds of largemouth last year). The white braid might have actually helped me catch more fish because I could see it move in an instant. I have also used braid tied directly to 1/8 oz jigworms for finesse fishing and, again, no difference noted in catchability. I was in clear MN lakes with up to 13' visability and the white braid works on the surface on a sunny day under a dock.

I really like braid, but there is a learning curve. Keep a pair of leather gloves in the boat. Don't try to pull out a snag wih your hands or the rod. You will cut your hands, break your rod, or bury the line in the spool.

Another plus is that you can get a good hookset with a simple flick of the wrist which is nice when you have inexperienced people in the boat that do a wimpy hook set.

I use the uni-knot because I have been using it forever and I can tie it with my eyes closed. I do 7 turns around the loop. NEVER had a failure at the knot. Never! I use 6 and 8 lb on my walleye jig rods (I do use a 18 -24" flouro leader unless on a river), 15 or 20 on bass rods, and 30-50 on baitcasters. You can really rip a Rat-L-Trap out of the cabbage with this stuff!

Chuck



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 01/11/2007 10:53AM by Chuck Mills.

Brian,

Direct from the owner:

"Duane:

I guess a really long time is the correct answer. PowerPro is made of
Spectra, an Ultra High Molecular Weight polyethylene. Polyethylenes
don't
absorb water like Nylon, and are far less susceptible to UV degradation
-
as a result they retain their properties for a very long period of
time.

However, PowerPro like the other "superlines", are not indestructible.
I
recommend that you inspect your line regularly; if you see fraying,
that's
your indication that it's time to Retie. When the line on the reel
gets
too low, don't tie on an extension piece, remove the old line and put
on
new as you don't want splices in the middle of your line as this is the
weak point.

Thanks for your continued support, let me know if this was not an
adequate
answer to the question."

There you have it Brian. From the way I understand it Spectra is much tougher to break down vs nylons. Thanks for asking the question, the more we learn the better!

DR

One additional thought. Reels with out protected line guides and rods with standard metal guides. These systems well ware out with in a 1/2 season of fishing.
Good Wraps Bob

Thanks DR. I mostly river fish and hate to see a full cast's length of spectra dangling downstream from some killer holding water. Using a weaker leader alleviates that issue it would seem. Thanks for the info,

Brian

You're welcome Brian!

Everyone else.......

Since we're on this subject of loosing line.....I'd like to know how it happens to you guys, if it does, when using superlines. When I "snag", I simply pull STRAIGHT back with the rod pointed DIRECTLY AT the snag and the line breaks AT the knot on the lure 99.5% of the time for me. This means NO leftover line in ANY water ever. I cant do the same with nylon, the stretch won't let you and when it does break it can happen anywhere, typically leaving line IN the water.

I can remember the the last time I left a length of spectra in the water. It WAS my fault, and since it floated to the top and I was in a boat, I got to remove it after all. Thats the .5% I spoke of up above. Spectra, if used properly should just about never leave a length of line in any waters body. Sure there are going to be "things that happen" and it is possible to leave a piece behind, but for the most part that is user error and can be avoided most of the time.

DR

I use a mono backing on each reel, the amount depends on how much braided line I want to have on the spool. I also run a short shock leader of either mono or fluorocarbon. The backing is simply to better fill the spool since braided lines are so much thinner. The leader is for several reasons, first, if I get a snag or a break off, I don't loose a spool full of expensive braid, second it to allow for some shock insulation, and third, I feel it does prevent dragging the end of the line in the mud and then bringing all of that abrasive dirt back through my guides.

I tend to choose braided line more by diameter than by lb. test. I run a thicker line when casting heavier bait, and a lighter or thinner line when plugging. I also prefer not to have to deal with landing a large fish and dealing with a fine diameter braided line that can cut skin like piano wire. I have Power Pro 50lb. or 65lb. on most of my saltwater reels, and 15lb. to 30lb. on most of my freshwater rigs.

I don't think that most fish really are spooked by the line, I have used many types of lines, and I haven't seen much difference in catch rates with either line, and I do often run braid direct to the lure in freshwater. I suppose that the braided line doesn't look much different to a fish than a blade of grass or what ever.
If I do run a leader, it's pretty short, just to give the line a weak point incase of a deep water snag.

For saltwater, I think it's more important to properly set your drag, with your reel specs in mind as well as the lb test of the line. I've seen a few conventional reels with bend spool shafts from guys winching in huge fish on a reel that was never meant to handle the load.

I use 50 PowerPro for Striper fishing in the Surf here in NJ. I use a Fishfinder slider on the Main line and a 4-6 inch 80# leader snelled to a 8/0 Gamikatsu circle hook. catch lots of fish, Short leader gives great casting distance too.