Has anyone build spinning surf rod(s) for +30lb class on +8ft blanks that notice improved differences in casting using Fuji's KR Concept with any of the K guide series? I'm still new to this concept, and my next project involves building a 9ft 1pc surf rod in 12-30lb class from jaws. I was reading left ant right for weeks about Fuji's KR Concept, but there isn't any clarification about this new concept to work on surf rods. Any input from you guys is appreciated. thx.

Hi Boghy,
The concept is to get the the line choked down as quicly as possible. From there out they're all running guides and will work no matter what the length. Just choose the smallest running guides that will pass your knots. If you haven't read it Anglers Resource (on the left) have a lot of info and hi speed video on the ideas, both 27x and rapid choke. Hopefully some others will have built something like that and can give you some first hand experience. The concept is based on sound principles. I've built a 10 foot beach spinning rod using the 27x method and it casts great but my guides aren't Fugi's.

ESFNEM Col
Port Kembla, NSW
Australia

Here is a Test Casting event I set up and conducted in April using Fiber Star Composite blanks (1266). We threw each of the 4 sets ups 20 times, recorded teh distances: [www.stripersonline.com] Basically, the guides don't much matter as long as you set the rods up correctly.

Billy is right. If you put the right ring at the right height it doesn't matter what frame holds the ring in position (unless you prefer the tangle free feature of the K-Series). What Billy didn't mention is that they did not test a KR CONCEPT build on any of those surf rods and honestly, neither have I. The ideas behind KR are going to hold up regardless of the rod class. Rapid choke, smoother running line, added power and strength from more runners, increased sensitivity and so on. The question that is unanswered at this point is whether the frame strength is sufficient for this type of rod. John Martinez (Fiber Star) and I are working on that question now and he is sending me a blank to work with. I have a 9ft, one piece, KL beach rod that has had no problems as far as durability (and that includes a shark pulling the entire rod and reel around the gulf for an hour and half before another anglers hooked it and dragged it back on shore last winter). The KL-H frame uses frame members that match the KL in thickness and strength and my hunch is they will hold up fine. Still, the KL-H will not match the strength of the KW-H (double foot) which we anticipate arriving in the first half of next year. When I get the blank (John?), I will keep everyone posted.

For light use and light line the KR as it is right now is fine. I'm waiting for the KW-H to arrive to really put it to the test on a 10'6" and 9' blank rated 1-4, That IMO will the true test! I know the concept works as far as casting is concerned but I just think the guides are a tad light for med weight plugging blanks.. The KR is killer on freshwater/ Salmon type blanks that for sure!! Jim your blank is on it's way!!

Theoretically speaking, for running guides, are Fuji LDB's stronger then KB's or none will be good for my 12-30lb class rod? I understand that in reality this is still under ongoing tests, although i would like to try myself as well. I still try to understand how short is too short in running down the line from the stripper to the first runner guide. Can anyone tell me why the GPS software from anglers resource change the choker point at a closer distance from spool's shaft when selecting the KL-H and on any other tabs is at an more far away point? I always believed that the choker point is a set point based on the reel's required measurements. I'm somewhat confused by this.

The KL-H tab in GPS uses a completely separate set of formulas for computing a "Rapid Choke" point when using these particular guides. KL-H guides were made to satisfy these results of Fuji's research. Rapid Choke does not officially apply to any other guide frames (although experimentation is always welcome).

KR CONCEPT is a new concept reflective of the research Fuji has completed on micro and/or braid guide layout. In that body of work, engineers discovered that a specific choke point slightly closer to the reel outperformed the traditional choke point outlined in the New Guide Concept. Optimum guide efficiency is based on "total energy used". KR sacrifices a miniscule amount of energy on a closer choke point but saves energy by getting the line into a smooth flowing configuration earlier in the cast. Smooth flow uses far less energy. More energy is saved through the running guides than is spent in the shorter choke. RESULT: more net energy (momentum) remains in the lure and casting distance increases slightly. All other benefits of the KR CONCEPT stem from a longer running train. Power, sensitivity, hook set, recovery - all are bonuses made possible by line running through more small, low running guides.

KR Rapid Choke is not an arbitrary new choke. It has been very carefully determined to avoid line slap, overchoke and "bagging" and It's always in relation to the choke point we have been calculating for years.

Just to answer you question Boghy, The LDB IMO is the strongest single foot guide out there. i think we get to hung up thinking we NEED to use certain guides for certain setups. I think and was just talking about this today with someone a if Fuji did a LDB #8, this in conjuction with double foot KR guides would make an out standing layout. The 6 LDB work great but.. Try and convince surf guys of this is impossiable

Well, today i start building the 9ft jaws blank, where i added the eva grips, butt and the reel seat, i'm just waiting for the epoxy to dry up to test the guides that i got today, but - i have some doubts. I ordered KW's 30, 20 & 10 as well as KL-H 25, 12, 5.5 and about 8 LDB's for the belly section plus size 5 tip. I'm still not sure if should i play around with KW's or just go straight with KL'H. The frame on KLH seem to be strong but of KW's obviously is much stronger. On top of that i've read somewhere on this forum that KT's are pretty strong as well for running guides. Most of the time i'm using FG knots aka sebile knots between braid and mono, so size 5 for tip, i don't see as being a problem, although i'm not sure yet which path to take for the reductions guides KW's or KLH. Can anyone give me an advice? thx



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 08/12/2012 02:20AM by Boghy Brock.