Good evening.

I have been having trouble with Gudebrod thread - fuzzies. Especially on the smaller diameter tip sections of a fly blank. I guess due to the extreme flexing of the thread on the smaller diameter.

Discussed the problem with a sponsor and Fish Hawk thread was recommended as a viable substitute. Started to wrap this P.M. and discovered that the FH thread has a much "looser" twist than the GB which makes for a flatter lay. The lays of fiber in the FH untwist, it seems, too easily.
I would say that the GB has about 5 twists to every one of the FH thread after wrapped. Something that one would expect of silk.

Does anyone use FH thread and what is the practical significance of its looser twist to the final product?
Thanks.
Herb

I use both. I have seen the same thing w/ the FH nylon thread, and no longer use it for my rods. I noticed that it was harder to pack than Gudebrod, and I would end up with gaps no matter what I did. That being said I use the FH mettalics exclusively, they are FAR superior to the Gudebrod mettalics. The mettalic does not unravel nor does it have that goofy corkscrew effect when it comes off of the spool.

Scott Sheets
www.smsrods.com

Scott,
Thanks.

I can do without gaps - I will ship FH back to sponsor and, I guess, put up with the Gudebrod unless someone has a better alternative.
Herb

Just found a web site by Roger McCourtney. Roger states that his experiance with FH is dismal. Thread does not cut cleanly, frays and does not take finish evenly - blotchy.
Herb

Just found a web site by Roger McCourtney. Roger states that his experiance with FH is dismal. Thread does not cut cleanly, frays and does not take finish evenly - blotchy.
Herb

Herb, I would agree with the cutting also. But again, only on the Nylon. I love their mettalics, they are great.

Scott Sheets
www.smsrods.com

I recently tried a spool of the Rodsmith Stay True. Really like the way it handles and the color on the spool is what you get. I like it better than the GB NCP. Crisper color. Haven't tried the RS regular nylon yet so no comment. Also give a thumbs up to the FH metallics, but hard on cutters. Lurk here a lot, but don't post much. 25+ year hobby builder.

I haven't experienced the problems mentioned above with FishHawk nylon but I've only
wrapped a couple rods in the last 5mo. I used it exclusively for a while last year weaving
& cross-wrapping and had no issues and was very impressed with the metallics.

Raymond Adams
Eventually, all things merge, and a river runs through it..

I've been using Fishhawk more and more and haven't had any of the problems experianced above. IT's a little thinner than Gudebrod, and the fact that it lays flatter makes it easier to apply finish to.

FishHawk Thread has been around a long time and it's not known for those problems. I use it and have never had problems with blotchiness or anything else for that matter. You may simply have gotten a bad spool or 2, just like happens with the Gudebrod from time to time.

Send it back to Robbie Smith at Fish Hawk, direct, and explain the situation. Robbie is probably the first thread supplier that really cares about the rod builders and takes an active role in working with them to get the thread we ask for. I think you'll find him quite receptive to solving your problem. He'll also be at the Expo for anyone that would like to discuss thread with him there.

..................

I also have been using FishHawk for quite sometime and haven't experienced any of the problems mentioned above, which is why I recommend it to anyone who asks which thread they should get. But also as stated above the metallics are far superior to the Gudebrod. Thanks Scott Parsons

We are more than happy to replace or refund for any thread which is bad or does not meet customer satisfaction for any reason. Our goal is to produce a nylon thread which is fuzzy free, lays flat, and can be tightly packed. Our FishHawk brand of nylon was produced strictly for rod builders so it is very important to me that everyone is happy with the performance of the thread. If not, then it will be replaced with a smile.
We are displaying at the Expo and I look forward to meeting everyone. We will showing some new and wild looking threads and will value opinions on the new stuff!

Many Thanks,

Robbie

As always, thank you all.

I finished one short wrap on a single footed guide and actually liked the look - flatter. But along the way there were one or two very long (3mm) single strand fibers that were visable. I was able to "snap" them off with a tweezer.
But the finished wrap looked good - very flat.

I will call Robbie today and discuss - but in the meanwhile does anyone know if the metallics will lay lower on the blank to match the nylon. I wouldn't want the metallic trim to stand much higher in the wrap than the nylon. That is why I switched from Gudebrod to sulky for metallics.

Also, Billy is the reason you do not have to use CP because you use FH thread???
FH site that one does not have to use CP to retain color. I don't know if I will like that since I really do not like vivid colors on the finished blank. Dark purple in Gudbrode just has a hint of color. Perhaps the FH will really be purple.

Herb

No, I don't use CP because I use underwraps on most of my rods, which are SW. I ONLY use Nylon thread, whether it be Gudebrod, Fishhawk, or The NERBs Thread, and I put it over a metallic underwrap. Nylon threads do not automatically get darker when you apply epoxy, tehy go TRANSLUCENT, so whatever teh color is below it, it kind of "blends" together. So if you wrap White over black, you get black because it'smore dominating of a color. When you put white over silver, you get white. Yellow over Blue will result in a greenish bluish color, and blue over yellow the Blue wil pretty much stay the same becasue it's a darker color than yellow.

Herb, sinc eyou are in tesing mode, either paint or do a wrap with a light color on a scrap blank. WRap over this, as well as bare blank with a Nylon thread. Epoxy it and see what happens, I think my explanation will make more sense then.

Any time you use a new product, there will be a learning curve. Sometimes with a brand new spool of thread, you might need to emove the top layer, as quite often teh thread sits on the shelf of a shop/factory and accumulated dust partices and general crap, which can possibly damage the thread. This is true regardless of the thread you purchase, unless eaach spool is individually sealed like Madeira, or Fishhawk Silk.

I spoke to Robbie tdy. Very cooperative. He is sending me sample of metallic and I am going to do a couple of test wraps on my "testing blank" and see what I will see.

Billy - I understand re underwraps and see now why you do not need CP.

All of my wraps are on fly rods except for a retro I did for my son in Dix Hills on a 50's Conolon blank that was my fathers and mine for party boat fishing on the Rose & Jim. If you have any fishermen in your family in their 70's or 80's or, if they can still string two words together, their 90's will remember the boat. It was about a 35 footer, wood of course, low to the water, painted pipe railings with one big diesel. It used to sail out of a South Shore inlet - forgot which - but probably Fire Isl or Jones'. The main "cabin" had benches all around the engine and if you could stand the noise you could nap or keep warm in the fall.
We caught a lot of fluke, sea bass and conger eels. I remember one guy caught what was a huge silver eel.

The rods were built by a gentleman who owned a bait and tackle shop near the Cross Bay Blvd bridge - name of Marino. Called there a couple of years ago - shop still there but the young owner did not know Marino. He did magnificant work with different materials than we have tdy.
Regards - thank you all for your help.
Herb.