By the way, John, next time you want to build a trout fly rod that your friends will laugh at, but that fishes really great, finish out the blank with a $3-5 size 16 cushioned spinning reel seat (Fuji, PacBay, Batson, AmTak) and use the inexpensive chrome or black-framed ceramics (Hialoy or Batson H-ring) that cost about 70 cents each. You'll end up with a rod that just flat out functions flawlessly and will actually be less expensive to build because you spend much less on the seat and only a few dollars more on the guides. Better performance all around and you can still wrap the rod pretty if you're into that.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 03/09/2006 01:50PM by Steve Kartalia.

The last tuna rod I made cost $240.58 in parts. That was with no fancy components, and wholesale (through Merrick). I have made passable fly rods for the $ I paid for the tuna blank.

It's another world when you deal with offshore tackle. The guy I made this last pair of tuna rods for fishes out of a $500,000 boat and burns $250 a day in gas. He thinks $400 per rod is a steal.

By contrast, I fish out of a $20 pair of waders and burn through about $5 worth of beer a day.

Don't know if any one mentioned it the Fuji Nitrate II

What good are the SiN guides for an Inshore SW rod. Let's not get lost from the original question, he's building a Popping rod on a pretty light blank.

Now all we gotta do is introduce the people who make titanuim guides to the garbage can marketing principle!

Bill Stevens - Sounds like I could use a little education. Could you please explain the "garbage can marketing principle" ... ? ... Thanks, -Cliff Hall+++ cmkmhall@ufl.edu

Cliff,

I have a feeling that Bill is referring to Andy Dear's marketing techniques used at the Rodbuilidng Show. Andy places his sale blanks in large trash cans.

Bret

Aah, make it accessible. Break the untouchable image / unaffordable barrier. if you let the customer see it, feel it and play with it, they will be free to conclude that they want one, too? ... Very schmart, and practical. ... Works at all levels of sales. ... Thank you, Bret, ... -Cliff Hall+++

Interesting read all.

Here's my little take on the quesiton:

1. For something that one would use only a few times a year, I would not use Titanium for that reason. Just rinsing it down after use is easy enough and the $$ is not worth it. Steel is relatlively corrosion resistant if one just rinses the rod down.

However, that said, I would still use titanium for these reasons:

1. The weight savings matters increasingly on a lighter blank. The lighter the blank, the more it matters. Your blank is not as light as the ones I would use for UL/L but still, I think you can tell the difference.

2. I figure that my labor/time is the most valuable part of the rod and I might as well use the better components if it would make a performance difference.

3. I also figure that with titanium guides, they should last indefinitely so when the blank breaks, I can just recover the guides and reuse them for the next rod. If the steel is corroded even a bit or broken, that won't happen since I myself would want to build only with pristine components - again due to my labor.

4. Incidentally, for the smaller guides, Titans are heavier than the Fuji Titanium SICs.
For example, size 5 Titan fly guide is .12 grams, and Fuji Titanium SIC is between .075 and .08 grams. About .05 grams difference. A Recoil size 6 spin is .06 grams. On light rods, the difference is noticeable. On heavy rods, probably not.

Mo

...If it comes to the corrosion issue I just can recommend to use not too much coating on the ring feet, especially there should be NONE under the foot where he (the ring leg) is coming up. If you do this properly - bringing the yarn end not too close to the "ringknee" and using the epoxy coating carefully you should have open space at teh sides of the ring feet - water can go easily in but can be rinsed out perfectly. To bring out (salt) water from one of these cracks how they come by time through regular usage is more or less impossible. I have seen this with a factory made XP, it looked hoorible.

So if you want to save some money go with the alconites, that are pretty good guides. Especially in chrome I like their appearance very much. With good care and proper installation as mentioned in my text it should be okay.

Regards from Germany,
Ole

John, one last thought. I have fished the salt all my life and honestly I have not found that washing down the rod after usage does a lot for preventing rusting of guides. The rods is out there for maybe 8 hours or more of fishing. It has to travel back home for the wash down. There is plenty of time there for problems to set in. It all depends on your personal tolerance to corrosion. Me I hate it but put up with it on my spinning rods but not on my fly rods.
It's down to you and the depth of your pockets
Regards
Mike

Enjoy the rod however you build it.

DOUBLE-POST ... DELETED .... Cliff Hall+++



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 03/12/2006 09:39PM by Cliff Hall.

Mike Oliver - When you swim out to your fishing rocks, doesn't the rod routinely get submerged in the salt-water on at least one tide. ... ? ...

Like your saying, Mike, in that kind of situation, you aren't seeing much benefit when you rinse down the rod. Maybe water stays between the guide rings and the guide frame, even after a freshwater rinsing 2 or 10 hours later. And maybe most of your corrosion was occuring that way.

I know that in my normal / light duty surf fishing, rinsing the frame helps keep salt crystals from forming. When salt crystals are forming, the electrolysis voltage is at its worst, which accelerates the corrosion the most. In one situation, it may only take a few hours for crystals to form, while in another situation, it may take 12-24 hours. Once a salt crystal has formed, the evaporation has sucked all the water out and can make the voltage increase like a 1000 times, from a few millivolts to several volts, maybe more. It is just like reverse electro-plating, ...

MAYBE Mike, you get several cycles of wet and dry, in one day, which is like 10 times the electrolysis rate of a lite-duty sandpiper surf fisherman like me. By the time you get home after 8 or 12 hours of fishing, the guides have already seen at least one full cycle of electrolysis. ... So, the damage is already done. For you, Rinsing off the guides at home just stops the N+1th rust cycle. ... At least that's my hypothesis on why rinsing doesn't do much for your guides.

... I hardly go past my calves anymore, and the rod only gets salt on it from spray, not dunking. So rinsing with freshwater makes a difference for me. I still remember those few times when I got lazy and waited until "manyana" [tomorrow] to rinse off & clean up my tackle after a salt-water trip. And, on my tackle, not rinsing the rod guides almost always caused signs of spot corrosion. Especially on scratched aluminum reel seats.

Rust never sleeps, my friends, ...
... IMO, ... -Cliff Hall+++, Gainesville, FL-USA*****

Re: Nanolite vs. SiC help ... Mike Oliver ... July 26, 2005 12:35PM
[www.rodbuilding.org]
"Now I am not an occasional Angler, and I have had SICs on some of my rods for over 8 years. I swim out to rocks to fish, and my gear gets a hammering."