I
nternet gathering place for custom rod builders
  • Custom Rod Builders - This message board is provided for your use by the sponsors listed on the left side of the page. Feel free to post any question, answers or topics related in any way to custom building. When purchasing products please remember those who sponsor this board.

  • Manufacturers and Vendors - Only board sponsors are permitted and encouraged to promote and advertise products on the board. You may become a sponsor for a nominal fee. It is the sponsor fees that pay for this message board.

  • Rules - Rod building is a decent and rewarding craft. Those who participate in it are assumed to be civilized individuals who are kind and considerate in their dealings with others. Please respond to others in the same fashion in which you would like to be responded to. Registration IS NOW required in order to post. You must include your actual First and Last name and a correct email address when registering or posting. Posts which are inflammatory, insulting, or that fail to include a proper name and email address will be removed and the persons responsible will be barred from further participation.

    Registration is now required in order to post. You must include your actual First and Last name and a correct email address when registering or posting.
SPONSORS

ICRBE 2020
EXPO ON FACEBOOK
CCS Database
Int. Custom Rod Symbol
Common Cents Info
American Tackle
Anglers Rsrc - Fuji
Anglers Workshop
BatsonRainshadowALPS
BRC Rods
Cork Specialties LLC
CRB
HNL Rod Blanks–CTS
CTS New Zealand
Custom Fly Grips LLC
Decal Connection
Flex Coat Co.
Get Bit Outdoors
Hitena USA
HYDRA
Janns Netcraft
Mickels Custom Rods
Mudhole Custom Tackle
MHX Rod Blanks
North Fork Composites
Pacific Bay
ProProducts
REC Components
ReelSeatBlanks.com
Renzetti Inc.
Rod Builders Warehouse
RodHouse France
RodMaker Magazine
RodMaker Blog
Schneiders Rod Shop
SeaGuide Corp.
Tackleworks
The Rod Room
Trondak U-40
Utmost Enterprises
VisualWRAP/VisualWEAVE
ZipCast

Porous Shim Tape
Posted by: Jack Duncan (---)
Date: May 09, 2020 02:17PM

In the 20+ years I've been crafting graphite and glass fly rods, I've used masking tape to shim up a blank for a reel seat or handle. The use of masking tape seems to be the standard shim to create a tight fit. I did read years ago, that some builders use package wrap tape because it is "harder" when layered, and not as "spongy" as masking tape. I tried it once years ago, but found it very difficult to work with and achieve a smooth surface on the shim.
Since, I've always wondered about finding and using a porous tape of some kind, which would allow the epoxy glue to flow through the tape to more firmly and permanently adhere the reel seat/handle to the blank. So recently I did some on line research and found a porous 1/2" medical tape, from a company in Mass. I ordered some, and have received it. It's very sticky, which is good, and contains natural rubber latex. It doesn't stretch at all, but when layered is a bit more spongy than masking tape.
Finally, and I apologize for the long lead up to my question: have any of you ever tried a porous tape for use as a shim? And if tried, is it a better bond than masking tape? Please comment.
Thanks, Jack

Options: ReplyQuote
Re: Porous Shim Tape
Posted by: Tom Kirkman (Moderator)
Date: May 09, 2020 02:38PM

You seem to have been out of the loop for the past three decades - masking tape is quick and easy, but has never been considered the best method for shimming reel seats. Many builders have long used fiberglass drywall tape for their shims/bushings and the rigid urethane foam arbors, may be the ultimate method for shimming seats. When properly used, they are faster to fit and assemble than any type of tape. And, of course, there is always the use of thread or cord for close fitting assembles.

..............

Options: ReplyQuote
Re: Porous Shim Tape
Posted by: Norman Miller (---)
Date: May 09, 2020 02:41PM

My favorite is dry wall tape. The mesh allows for the epoxy to penetrate to the blank. I tack the leading edge of the tape to the blank using super glue, this prevents the tape from ‘walking’ after the epoxy is applied. It is lighter, and cheaper than masking tape and a roll will last a long time.
I also like the polyurethane foam arbors for reel seats. I glue them into the reel and then ream to fit the blank. This prevents them from splitting. The dry wall fiberglass tape is again much cheaper then the polyurethane foam arbors.
Norm



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 05/09/2020 02:48PM by Norman Miller.

Options: ReplyQuote
Re: Porous Shim Tape
Posted by: David Sytsma (---.res.spectrum.com)
Date: May 09, 2020 02:50PM

Jack,

I always use fiberglass mesh drywall tape. It's cheap, a 2" x 300' roll lasts for years, you can easily cut it to any width or length you need, it's porous, and doesn't degrade. Just sort of trowel your epoxy into the tape as you go with a popsicle stick, or smear it well over and into the shim after you've built it. You can get it at any hardware or big box store (Home Depot, Lowes, ect.). I'm in the process of renovating a spinning rod for my grandson that he found washed up on the beach at Lake Michigan. No telling how long it had been in the lake, but I'll bet it was several years. When I cut the compromised EVA grips off, I found they had had been shimmed with masking tape. That tape was as sticky and unchanged in condition as the day it was used as a shim. There wasn't any epoxy impregnation whatsoever. I believe the reel seat is shimmed the same way but appears to be okay, so I'm going to take a chance on it. But, if there ever was any question in my mind about which shim material I want to use, that sealed the deal. I'll always use the fiberglass mesh drywall tape.

Dave Sytsma

Options: ReplyQuote
Re: Porous Shim Tape
Posted by: Herb Ladenheim (---.lightspeed.rcsntx.sbcglobal.net)
Date: May 09, 2020 02:52PM

The best, as Tom states, is foam.
Drywall tape is O.K for very thin applications - and even then you have to snug it down with thread so the layers don't slide when you install the seat.
Best to install the foam arbor on the blank first. Then install the seat after the arbor to blank epoxy is fully cured. As Tom again states - you may have to shim the arbor to seat interface with thread.
Herb

Options: ReplyQuote
Re: Porous Shim Tape
Posted by: Bob Ginther (162.245.179.---)
Date: May 09, 2020 04:02PM

One word of caution on the drywall tape. If the epoxy has not set when you slide your reel seat over it, there is a possibility the whole coiled stack may be pulled with the reel seat. The result could be a real seat that sets up not concentric to the blank. Don't ask me how I know... I still use it, but very carefully watch to make sure the stack does not move, etc. Still trying to master that technique.

Options: ReplyQuote
Re: Porous Shim Tape
Posted by: John DeMartini (---)
Date: May 09, 2020 04:56PM

When I first started rod building the thought of using masking tape or any other type of ply application never entered my mind ( I was not bright enough). So I used to turn down wood arbors (spacers), preferably from discarded broom handles.

When graphite arbors came on the scene I jumped on it. I buy the next size up and turn it down for a snug fit. Works great and gives me piece of mind.

Options: ReplyQuote
Re: Porous Shim Tape
Posted by: Norman Miller (---)
Date: May 09, 2020 05:35PM

As I mentioned above, tack the leading edge of the tape to the blank with super glue, and you will not have the coil of tape moving or walking when sliding on the real seat or part that you are shimming.
Norm

Options: ReplyQuote
Re: Porous Shim Tape
Posted by: Tom Kirkman (Moderator)
Date: May 09, 2020 05:37PM

John DeMartini Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> When I first started rod building the thought of
> using masking tape or any other type of ply
> application never entered my mind ( I was not
> bright enough). So I used to turn down wood arbors
> (spacers), preferably from discarded broom
> handles.
>
> When graphite arbors came on the scene I jumped on
> it. I buy the next size up and turn it down for a
> snug fit. Works great and gives me piece of mind.

Best way to do it.

..............

Options: ReplyQuote
Re: Porous Shim Tape
Posted by: David Sytsma (---.res.spectrum.com)
Date: May 09, 2020 07:23PM

Yeah, I'll plead guilty and eat some humble pie. I started a thread a while back where I had my arbors/shims move on me and the reel seat wasn't parallel to the blank. Had to cut it off and do it again. I think the culprit was the reel seat should have been sized one size smaller, but I already had the 24 and didn't want to have to order the 22 I should have used and the arbors were a little too big. On the re-do I tacked the drywall tape to the blank with super glue as was mentioned before putting the epoxy on, wound it on firmly while adding epoxy at intervals to ensure that the arbor was fully saturated, then took some scrap thread and wrapped the arbors in place. I also let it set up a little before putting the reel seat on. Worked fine that time.

I still like fiberglass mesh drywall tape if the gap you are trying to shim is only an eighth inch or less. You just can't ask it to shim up a quarter inch without a lot of care. I do like foam arbors for putting reel seats on small diameter light and ultralight spinning rods where you have a lot of room to make up.

Dave Sytsma

Options: ReplyQuote
Re: Porous Shim Tape
Posted by: Michael Sutheimer (---.wi.res.rr.com)
Date: May 10, 2020 04:34AM

I use drywall tape as well. However I don't like the bit of slop you get, just cannot wrap it tight enough.So I use masking tape with it. But only to keep things lined up. Let me explain. I will wrap the blank at the very ends on the reel seat location. I want a very tight fit. Then I will use the drywall tape in between. I don't get a real tight fit on the drywall tape. Actually try to leave a very slight gap. I use a paste type epoxy so the gap is easily filled. Works out great reel seat is lined up perfectly and I have a nice solid nearly all epoxy bond between the blank and reel seat. I put just a thin film of epoxy on the masking tape and between the reel seat and grip. I rely on the mid section of drywall tape and epoxy to actually hold the reelseat structurally.

I tried the graphite arbors years back. They seemed to be very inconsistent size wise. Same size one would be a force fit the next one the reel seat would drop right over. Also they were a pain to ream. One would be soft and ream like butter next one would be rock hard. Never got around to trying the foam ones. Nearly all my reel seats incorporate some type of insert that is bored fairly close to blank O.D. . If I do a standard seat one of these days I will definitely give the foam a try.

Options: ReplyQuote
Re: Porous Shim Tape
Posted by: roger wilson (---)
Date: May 10, 2020 11:54AM

I did a test wrap with drywall tape and epoxy. But, I didn't like to use it at all.

So, if I don't use a foam, cork or graphite arbor I will use masking tape. Particularly when only a thin shim is needed. I use 1/4 inch wide tape at each end and then 3/4 inch wide in between. In between each row of the tape wraps, I leave about a 1/32 - 1/16th inch gap that is filled with epoxy when the grip and reel seat is assembled. This completely encapsulates the tape and it also gives a very solid attachment between the rod blank and the reel seat or grip.

Easy to do, and at least for me has never failed.

Best wishes

Options: ReplyQuote
Re: Porous Shim Tape
Posted by: Lance Schreckenbach (---.lightspeed.hstntx.sbcglobal.net)
Date: May 12, 2020 03:03PM

Graphite, Foam, Drywall tape and masking tape. Use them all sometimes in combination, as needed. I try to use as little masking tape as possible. I also wish those graphite arbors would be a little more consistent in diameter and density.

Options: ReplyQuote
Re: Porous Shim Tape
Posted by: roger wilson (---)
Date: May 12, 2020 06:28PM

Lance,
Copy your comment on the variations in some of the arbors.

But, because I was finding this to be true, I took care of the issue for my self.

I made a jig that I fit to my lathe. I would purchase oversized arbors and then turn them down to the correct dimension - in a minute or so per arbor and then, used them with no issue at all.

Once you have a setup in place on your lathe, you can remedy this issue in a very very short time.

Yes, it would be nice to have all of the components come sized correctly. But, the solution is easy and quick in time to resolve the issue.

Take care

Options: ReplyQuote
Re: Porous Shim Tape
Posted by: Brian Jackson (---)
Date: May 16, 2020 10:39PM

Personally, I won’t use anything but graphite arbors. I glue them into the reel seat, let dry then ream to fit the blank tight. Granite to graphite to reel seat to hand enhances sensitivity in my opinion. At least in spinning applications

Options: ReplyQuote


Sorry, only registered users may post in this forum.
Webmaster