Are there any pros and or cons with using different types (CP/NCP) and brands of thread?
Thanks,,,
Tom

If you want a translucent look to the thread, which I prefer, then use NON ncp thread.

If you want to use a thread where the color stays true, but a bit dull, then either use CP on nylon thread, or use NCP thread.

The brand thread is your choice.

Be safe

I think it mainly depends on the finished look you want to achieve. Generally speaking NCP is not as strong (tensile strength) however the difference is minimal when wrapped on a guide. NCP also has a tendency to loosen up (go a tad slack) if coated with CP after a wrap is completed. NCP gives the "flattest" look and, when size A is wrapped & packed well it will look like paint on a blank. CP on nylon will give the "brightest" / "shiniest" result. Nylon without CP will become transparent - this look is very appealing when wrapped over gold or silver thread as the nylon takes on a "candy apple" appearance. Polyester without CP can turn "blotchy" and 'streaky" . I'll leave "tricks" used when working with Madiera thread to someone else as I don't use it myself.

You really need to try some yourself to get what you think is the right appearance. It's all so subjective. I disagree that nylon thread with CP looks dull. I have never used any color of nylon with CP that came out looking what I would call dull. Many argue that NCP is a little dull in comparison. I agree that using regular nylon without CP has a translucent look. It's because most of the true color is lost and the thread becomes almost transparent. This is how to make the wraps almost disappear, like a "stealth" look. Some threads used this way give great colors, but it's so unpredictable that there is no way to communicate such a subjective subject adequately. The old Gudebrod garnet, for example, used without CP turns a rich black cherry color that IMHO looks wonderful on many grey and black blanks.

It seems that many builders have their own favorite brands, and again, I think you just have to try them and come to your own conclusions. I have used Gudbrod, Pro Wrap, Fuji, and a couple others I forget, and I've found them all satisfactory. I buy more for the ability to get the color I want rather than buying by brand.

Tom

Regardless of color, NCP vs. non-NCP, nylon vs. silk vs. poly, best practice is to make test wraps on the blank in the grip or reel seat area. NCP nylon is not supposed to color shift with finish application, but it does just a bit. Non-NCP nylon and silk can color shift a bunch depending in part on the color of the blank. What might work wonderfully on a white blank can be a disaster on black, and the other way around too.

It's all about the aesthetics, and the best way to know what the end result will be and whether or not one or more combinations of CP vs. NCP vs. translucence is pleasing to your eye is via test wraps.

Thomas

I mix and match regular nylon and ncp nylon threads often, depending on the outcome I desire. I just finished up a rod that I used 4 different colors of ncp thread on (and 1 metallic) and it came out beautifully! The rod I am currently wrapping will have 1 regular nylon and 1 ncp thread on it (and 1 metallic plus some sulky holoshimmer) and so far it looks great. I have never (35 rods) used regular nylon without cp. When I pick a color - that''s the color I want it to be when I am finished.

Rog

Not to hijack the thread, but this brings up a question in my mind. What is the difference between polyester thread (Fuji Ultra Poly) and nylon thread (ProWrap)? I've noticed the Poly thread does not darker as much as the nylon, is that because of a different compound of just the fact that it is different brands?

Nate, what you are asking is part of the original question, so no hijacking going on.

I have used many colors of Pro-Wrap and just the red shades of Fuji, and I don't see a significant difference. Both with CP come out true to color and very bright/rich looking. I have not tried the Fuji without CP.

There may not be a full understanding of the advantage in some cases, to get certain looks, of using regular nylon without CP. If you want the guides to disappear on the blank, use the closest color nylon to the blank and don't use CP. If you want colors, usually muted, darker, or more translucent, than you can find on the market, experiment with regular nylon without CP. It is an entirely different look, and can be very handsome. I don't think you will ever get a bright color on regular nylon without CP. The change is a lot more than just a color shift. You can simulate the look to some degree by doing a test wrap and put some alcohol on it. I'm told, but I have no experience, that white silk without CP turns almost clear. Maybe someone with experience will comment on that.

I think an earlier comment mentions that Fuji stretches less than nylon. I had not noticed that, but it could be true. Stretch is advantageous for nail knots, to keep them tight until trimmed and stabilized. Theoretically, stretch would be advantageous to a lesser degree for the same reason on regular wraps.

I'm trying to absorb everything but the old brain needs a lot of re-caps before it soaks things up lately!
Most of what I've done(and that's very little) has been with NCP Pro Wrap but I have tried Fugi.Pac Bay and Makoi,,,all NCP thread.
In trying to use the colors I want I've used Pro Wrap and Makoi together on the same wraps but haven't done any finish coats on them yet.

I haven't tried any wraps using CP thread but will try that down the road a bit,,,I have to crawl before I can even stand up let alone walk!

Right now I'm trying to restore an old Cod rod for a cousin and it's coming out so-so.
I did under wraps with Pro Wrap size A thread,gave that a thin coat of finish and am in the process of wrapping the guides with Pro Wrap size D along with trim bands using Makoi size D thread.
I'm having a terrible time getting the guides on the center line of the rod and also keeping them lined up straight,,,,I have "something" on the retina of my right/dominant eye that several specialists can't figure out what it is so when I try to form a "sight picture" it gets blurred out!

I did a multi color chevron butt wrap using size A Pro Wrap and Makoi and when I finished it I saw that my alignment is off,,running the length of the rod,,,it's not quite on top of the rod.
I'm not happy with this but I can see and realize my mistakes and hope to do much better as I progress.

Thank you all for your help and input!
Tom

I do not try to get my guides straight and centered while wrapping, just get them close. After wrapping you should be able to move the guides to get them straight and centered. I get my wife to help me center the guides; she sights down the rod and tells me which way the guides need to go. So if your eyes are bad get a second person to help. This second person can also confirm your decorative wrap alignment marks to make sure they don't drift.
I have used most of the wrapping treads available and do not find much of a difference between them except for colors, and really do not have an overall favorite. All of the regular threads will darken and become translucent when finished without CP, the use of CP allows these threads to closely retain their original color and appear brighter then the no CP thread. The no CP threads retains the original color very well with or without CP, but gives a flatter and less bright look than the regular thread with CP.
Norm

Second person is a very good idea. Look at the Mudhole catalog and check out their lazer sighting device. It may be of interest to you. If you have a lazer level around the shop, try to tape it to the blank and check feasibility before you buy. Or borrow a friend's lazer level. Another possibility might be to tape a length of fishing line to the grip and run it to the tip.

But do the final alignment after wrapping. Another advantage of CP is that it tightens up the guides, but they still can be moved a little if you want to.

Good thread. Pun intended.

Once you get the guides close to straight turn the rod up side down and you should see a bit of guide on either side of the blank. Start with the tip and you should see an equal amount of guide on each side of the blank as you go down the blank. If you're sighting down the blank from the top the guides may arc a little to one side but your eye will follow the arc and they may appear straight. A long time ago I had a machinist put a screw thru the center of a metal penn reel seat base, real handy if you can get one made. Never tried the laser, maybe someone on here can post they're experience with it.

I use the laser from Mudhole and it is helpful in getting me to a good place with the guides but in the end I rely on putting a reel on the rod and looking down it. I have fished long enough to know when they are straight. The blank has to be straight for the laser to be exact and it does not take much for it to lie to you. Phil

I use sighting down the blank as a final check, but one method I use while wrapping does a very good job at aligning the guides. Loosely grasp the first guide between the thumb and foefinger and keeping that position vertically, slide the hand down the blank while in contact with the blank with the thumb and forefinger light pressure to the next guide and feel for alignmnent. It works pretty well to get them very close to final position. If one is out of alignment you'll feel more pressure on either the thumb or finger when it is contacted.

Worth a try. Dirt simple.

I bring the rod outside in the sun Best light I know of and jus look down the rod simple and easy
Maybe a bright colored fly line may help

Bill - willierods.com

Being a novice, I haven't used all the brands of thread. Fuji, Prowrap and Fishhawk are what I have used. I like them all. They do behave somewhat differently when finished with and without CP. I experiment, usually in the area where the reel seat goes, to get what I want for an end result. Using alcohol to wet the wrap will give you an idea what it will look like, but doesn't seem to me to be all that close. Your results may vary.

For final alignment of guides, I use a piece of 4wt fly line. Crimp a split shot on one end, run the other end through the guides and tape it to the center of the reel seat. I just bought the Mudhole laser sight. Haven't tried it yet. A friend of mine swears by his. I'll reserve judgement until I use it a few times.