So my last two spinning rods has been built with microwave guides (Ti Nano and SS nano) and now I'm venturing to another spinning rod build. Although I like the microwaves for simplicity I don't want to be too content yet and may try different guides and guide systems. Thinking KR alconites? Since SiC and torzite is out of my budget.. Or has anyone tried a combination of both KR and microwaves? I'm thinking airwave stripper and transition to 4-4.5 KR alconites running guides. Not sure of the weight differences in the running guides but what are your thoughts?

The Microwaves are a system that have been put together to work optimally. I would not suggest that you split up a set of guides . Either stay with the microwaves or try another system but dont mix two guide trains .

Myself I would stay with the Microwaves.

Rolly Beenen
Rovic Custom Rods

I see no problem with your proposal of mixing other guides with the first two Microwaves. Especially with lines like braids 15 and below.

I don't like the Microwaves because of the limitations of finish/design of the guides, having to buy the whole set.

I mostly use the Fuji K series now for spin and the KR stripper for casting. Both work very well and the spin setups offer different finishes and ring materials.

One aspect of both the Microwaves and K's is their height. This allows smaller rings and contributes to better casting performance, but if you're looking to use tube storage in a boat, make sure the rods will fit into the tubes. I built a rod for my son that had to fit into the tubes on his boat and used Y guides with only two reduction guides, and it works just fine. This rod is used with jigs and needs to make long casts and it does it just fine. I think he uses 20 pound braid.

Hate to say it but since the advent of the Microwave guides I don't find much benefit from spending a long time worrying about guide set up. Just use the Microwaves and set up as instructed. Seems to cast about as well as its going to get. On lighter rods I'll use the butt and transition guide and then use small Pacbay Minimas for the running guides. Now plan to use the Airwaves for a better match. It's just easy and works well.

I’ve built several of my rods using the Microwaves and found their casting performance to be comparable to the NGC or Rapid Choke guide set-ups. They are a bit heavier, however. I agree with Michael regarding mixing of guides. The Microwaves IMO, are only optimum for “general” use (one-size-fits-all) and presumably designed as such. Their design as a “set” may be fine for factory rods or where a custom builder can satisfy a customer if he/she has a broad range of use. The pre-determined “optimum” spacings can also be a time-saving advantage.
My best set-ups for using the Microwave System is by using the first three guides Microwaves, followed by Fuji 3.5s. The Fujis keep the weight down at the tip and makes the rod feel more crisp and responsive.
I also concur with Michael about having to buy the whole set. Unless I’m wanting a set-up that’ll accommodate a wide range of reels or lines, it’s not cost-affective. For rods that I build for specific reels and/or line use, I prefer the Rapid Choke System.

Recently I have built spinning rods using using microwave, Fuji KR micro and PacBay minima micro set ups, rarely with others. All three work very well; there is not that much difference in casting performance, and depends on what the customer likes. I have rods set up with all three different guide trains, which allows the customer to test cast each and make up his own mind. However, I personally prefer the Fuji KR and PacBay minima systems because they allow for a more custom approach to guide placement allowing for reel size, line used, and rod characteristics to be taken into account. I also do not like buying guides as a set with the one size fits all approach. I think the minima guides pair very nicely with light to medium actions rods, because they are so light, and gives these rods a very light and responsive feel. For the minma guides I use the M series for reduction guides because they have a very high frame (nearly as high as the KL-H guides), and use the F series for runners. I set them up as I do the Fuji KR guides. I have not been using the minimas that long so I cannot attest to their durability. The Fuji alconite KRs pair nicely with medium to heavy rods, because their sightly higher weight is less noticable. I do not commonly use the titanium/torzite guides because of their extreme cost. The alconites are still very light, and have a nice feel. For mainly cosmetic ressons, I do not like mixing different brands of guides, however I think mixing will not adversely effect functional performance. Hope this helps.
Norm

Sid,
As has been said many times in the past on this forum.

Use a guide on a rod at a particular location that meets the need of the client and the rod for the purpose for which it was intended.

It may be a 25 cent guide, or a $25 guide. If the guide suits the requirements, it is the right guide for you.

Be safe

If you are looking for another type of guide, look at the Pac-Bay Minima 4 guides. They are my go to guides.

John

Thanks guys. Thinking I'm going to purchase a few sets and try them all. I'll get some weights too. On a side note, anyone know what the actual IDs are for a size 4 and 4.5 alconites?

As a side note, it seems like Pac Bay is trying to phase out the terms minima 3 and minima 4, since the 2016 catalog list them together as only minima guides. I assume this was done to avoid the prior confusion associated with the 3 vs 4 designations.
The PAC Bay minima guides can be bought with a titanium alloy frame, they should be very light. I have not used them yet because they do cost more, and the stainless framed minima are already an extremely light guide, seems hard to justify the extra cost.
Have not measured the IDs for the Fuji alconite KR 4.5 and 4 guides, but the minima F size 4 is about the same ID as the Fuji 4.5.
Norm

The 4'S were double swagged where the 3'S were only rolled over on one side leaving an edge that could fray line

That is why the 4'S were the better guides
But
They did not come in all the nice colors or finishes

Bill - willierods.com

just built Microwave to 4mm micro guides wave guide looks like a 20 MM with a center 6 MM

MicroWaves -TidalWaves-AirWaves..