The definition of custom is: ""made specially for individual customers, or doing work to order." Hand made or built does not necessarily fit the true definition of "custom" but most of us use the term pretty loosely.

I actually built rods as an employee for one of the fine vendors listed on the left side of this page. The "custom" rods I built were done for outfitters and lodges, charter services and bait/tackle shops, etc. Some of the comments here are right on the button. If a fishing lodge ordered a half dozen 9 foot, 7 weight fly rods, then I would grab 6 of the blanks they wanted, spine them all and fit, arbor & glue all the reel seats at once. While the glue set, I would ream the chosen corks on the cork reaming machine, using a marked scrap blank of the proper rod weight to get the bore size close. The seat glue was now set so the final fitting/reaming of the cork for each rod is done & glued into place. While that glue set, guides were counted out & feet ground. By the time all the feet were ground, the cork glue would be set enough to safely handle. Tiptops were all glued into place & logo decals attached to the butt sections. The rods were aligned and fully assembled. Then the wrapping began. It was to take no more than 5 minutes to wrap a double foot guide for a plain wrap. That 9 foot rod would probably be done wrapping in 40-45 minutes. All 6 of those 7 weights would be ready for the wrap finish before the end of the day. The finishers started late in the day, so those 7 weights would be finished, dried & ready for shipping some time later the next day.

I learned a ton about wrapping & the production rod business while I was there. I did some pretty good work too, but I would never consider it custom by any stretch of the imagination. This was production. It was all hand done, but it was still production. Only volume made a business like this possible at the prices they charged their clients. How much mark up did the clients use? Who knows.

Tim Hough

I agree with Mr. Gamble,"Pay No Attention to the man behind the curtin"... It's on you, and if you depend to make a living at it, than it's all over you... and you better not try to wash it off, just get use to wearin it.

Dennis J. Danku
(Sayreville,NJ)

Chest beating? LoL

No, rather people who take pride in building a few rods vs. those who feel they must produce 1,000 per year.

There is one specific builder, even a sponsor on this board, who everyone on the discussion forums he posts on thinks he's the "shiznit". But when you look at the rods he builds it's total crap. Heaven forbid this hack post a picture of a "matched set" of rods together where you see them side-by-side. All his measurements are off and in different locations. I don't call someone like that a true custom builder. I call it someone who is in too deep to do decent work.

But hey...he's popular and sells alot of rods.

Tim,
You speak of hand done.
As far as I know, every rod out there is "hand done".
I haven't seen any machine that currently wrap guides on rods yet.

Have you?

Ok ....... now that the thread has been sufficiently hikacked ....... can we get back to this guy's original question?

........ "how does one go about setting prices for their rods? Is there a basic formula? Is a number picked out of the air?"

Please

Wow! Didn't mean to start a crap storm. Some one asked about components, from what I could tell they were all Batson butts and guides. I would assume the blanks were as well. I get quality of work, designs and artistic abilities. The rods I referenced all look decent. Nothing fancy, basic double wrapped guides and cross wrapped butts. I was just amazed at the price he was asking. Thus my original question of how builders set there prices. There was one builder at the expo a few years back that said MSRP price for parts and then labor was 1.5 times parts. That's the only time I've ever heard someone mention price setting. While all the above opinions are appreciated, I really was just asking how prices are set.

Tim, I'd agree that does sound like production having finishers and completing 6 builds in a day. Would be pretty cool to have that experience too.

I would suggest you charge what your market will bear. If you're doing this to make money, you need to sit down and figure up what you think not only your parts and time are worth, but what your knowledge is worth too. There is an old saying that goes something like this - "You don't get paid for what you do. You get paid for what you know." There is a lot of truth to that statement.

I often tell aspiring builders that if they truly want to make money at this, it's senseless to sell a rod for an amount that puts less than $100 net profit in your pocket. And that's the bare minimum.

Back to pricing - you might start by looking at the selling price of the closet comparable commercially made rod, and add at least $100 to that price and see if you can get any takers. If nothing else it would give you some place to begin.

It may be that you can't find anyone in your current market that will pay you what you need to make. In that case, you need to cultivate a different, higher end clientele.


............

That is pretty much what I do. I have a consult with the customer ask what he is going to use the rod for etc.....Then I tell him what the components will cost if he still is interested I tell him I charge 150.00 for my time and materials. It is usually cheaper then say a off the shelf rod. I say off the self cause I will not throw the big name companies under the bus. Besides if it was not for them we would never have this great hobby.

Lone Wolf Rods
"Keep your powder dry and your lines wet"
God Bless

You know when I was younger and fished everyday. I told my best friend that I could make a better rod then what we were using. We were using Berkley, Shimanoo. Nothing bad about them rods but, To make and catch fish with what you made is a good feeling. I just got a call from my friend last week now its been twenty years and he said you finally did it, you are making your own rods. That is the best feeling in the world when someone looks at what you made and has awe look on their face. I know I am not the greatest rod builder by a long shot, but it still feels good doing it. I think of it this way to I do a lot of hunting and shooting and I roll my own ammo is it better then the big name companies maybe not but it gets the job done, and I made the way I like it.

Lone Wolf Rods
"Keep your powder dry and your lines wet"
God Bless

But then again If the ammo you buy is not or does not have enough power to hit your target You make your own and - add more power to make it work

Just as rods cars no power add a blower to the motor
If it don't work -- make it work

Bill - willierods.com

One could use a sliding scale tied to the cost of the componets being used (higher price parts => higher cost for labor) plus the cost for extras like decorative butt wraps or using a new guide set-up design. This is just a thought and I toss it out for discussion only.

so I have heard of prices per guide anyone have a standard rate or now of some from their area?

My biggest recommendation is to learn on your own how to price your own product.

EVERY builder will have a different way of doing it. Asking 100 builders to explain how their pricing works will only complicate the process ( and confuse you) even more.

Tom has the easiest suggestion to understand...components plus $100 (minimum). I have profited <$100 on some projects and >$300 on others.

Price "per guide" works beautifully...until you start adding underwraps, triple wraps, 6 thread inlays, etc. All of a sudden that $5-$10 per guide starts shrinking...ALOT.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 04/17/2013 07:57AM by Jay Lancaster.

Thanks. So I guess the answer is there is no real answer. Thanks Tom for the suggestion. When I saw a rod for sale for cheaper than I could buy the parts it just made me wonder is all. Thanks to all who responded.

Problem with a formula that uses the components as a base line is that if you build on high end blanks with good components but also build some more affordable stuff using blanks of lesser cost and guides that are of a less expensive variety you loose out on the labor. The amount of effort to assemble the rod is the same if you use a solid fiberglass blank with stainless steel ring guides and a graphite seat or a top end high modulas graphite blank with titanium guides and fancy aluminum reel seat. You will make more on the high end rod than you did on the low end one but you worked just as hard. You need to figure a labor formula either per guide or per foot and add a fee for glue up of the seat and grips. That way you get compensated equally on either build. I work in a Ford /Lincoln dealer in the service dept. customer pays the same for a brake job on a Lincoln as they do on a Focus labor wise. The difference is in the parts. I see no reason your skills should not be compensated equally no matter what the price of the components are.

Freddwhy (Rapt-Ryte)

Fred,

That was how I understand the sliding fee scale. You're compensated for your labor (need to figure out what you need as a minimum for building the basic rod - nothing fancy) then based on component prices your labor goes up. Then you have adders for underwraps, decorative butt wraps, weaves, etc. Those prices could be based on thread count or some other metric.

In a since it is a take-off of the Lincoln and Focus, but with a twist based on parts cost.

Why would the pricing be anything other than the most you can get out of the rod? Of course you have to manage that price point with a long term view that allows you to get repeat business and grow your business the way you want to. But when you can't sell it, it is probably too expensive. When people are knocking your doors down and you can't keep up, move the price up. Since everyone has different objectives and skills, I think one just has to handle this one in the way it makes the most overall sense for each builder. I'm not a builder for profit, and never will be. I'm so slow that if I charged for my time I'd do better working at McDonalds.

Lol, Mick.....I think most of us would make more money at McDonalds.

______________________________________
Super Tight Lines......Don