If you're building heavy duty rods, then using an A underwrap and D over should essentially accomplish that goal without the need for an "underfinish". CP, yeah I can see that if it's needed but that's all I'd do. Now, if for some artistic reason I needed to do an overly complex artistic guide wrap where a smooth hard finish would be a definite benefit in helping me to get the result I needed, then yeah I'd consider the underfinish, but only if I wasn't able to get the results I wanted without using it.

A question for you guys stating you definitely do it. have you ever had a guide come loose in a situation where you have not underfinished and removed the topfinish and thread to find your top finish hasn't soaked the underwrap? I've never had a failure... I've re-finished a few older builds over the years and when I stripped the guides my finish has soaked the underwraps under two top wraps. It's pretty much one monolithic wrap.

NCP? I don't know, maybe that might be a factor to consider. I've never refinished a NCP wrapped rod I previously built with three layers of thread so I can't say one way or the other. I'm writing here only from regular thread experience.

Every one builds rods there own way
I just keep thinking of a hard finish is just easier to wrap over

Bill - willierods.com

Bill, I feel the same as you and do whatever is necessary but everyone finds their own way.

Dennis J. Danku
(Sayreville,NJ)

Some of you guys sure try to make things more difficult and complicated than they need to be. Make your underwraps, make your overwraps, use 2-3 coats of CP, let dry, then apply finish. It is that simple. I have done it for over 40 years and have never repeat "NEVER" had a problem with any of over 1500+ rods. Why make more work than you need to??

You should have no problem wrapping D thread over A thread. It sounds as if your underwrap may be a little loose or you have not packed the thread as mentioned above. On saltwater rods I am using D over D and have no problems with gaps on the overwrap. The key of course is to be sure that when you do your underwrap you have used proper tension and that you pack your wrap when its done. Then you shouldn't have any problem with your overwrap. This is especially true if your are wrapping by hand.

kevin gross Wrote:
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> For sure i am going to put a coat of finish on the
> underwraps. I dont trust it that the finish will
> soak through two coats of NCP thread and adhere to
> the blank along with filling in the tunnels.


Tunnels will fill with two overwraps just fine. I'm not so sure your epoxy adheres to the blank in the first place.

The epoxy is not what holds the guides on the blank. It's there for protection...that's my opinion (no scientific data to back it up).

I have never used a finish on an underwrap, not for freshwater spinning rods where I did an underwrap prior to learning to do trim rings, and not for 130 lb class saltwater rods.
Does the finish soak through the top wrap into the base wrap? No. Does it matter? Not in my experience.
I recently rewrapped a rod I built 35 years ago. It was an old lamiglass honey-colored glass blank, 20lb class boat rod. The colors had faded and the rod was in need of refinishing. When I removed the guides, the underwraps had little to no finish on them. In 35 years of hard fishing, it didn't make a difference.
The underwrap cushions the blank from *possible* damage caused by the guide feet. Whether or not there is finish on it doesn't, IMO, make a bit of difference. I have about 12 boar rods in different weights used for different fishing conditions. None of the blanks have ever failed.
Take the extra time, do the extra steps if you like. It won't hurt anything. But finishing the underwraps before wrapping the guides really isn't necessary.