Last night I laid a metallic under wrap on one guide repair job then applied epoxy and went to bed. This morning it was a lumpy mess. The thread was Sulky. I know it's been asked many times about CP and metallics. The common answer is no you don't need CP for color retention but it helps to eliminate bubbles. That answer is probably correct for dedicated brands such as Gudebrod or ProWrap. Apparently the sewing brands are siliconed. Of course, I've waited until the last minute to do this project so now I'm a little behind.

Mike,

If you've spent any time here on the forum, you might have read over and over that Sulky is indeed treated with a lubricant (it's a thread designed for use in sewing machine tensioners) and therefore requires sealing before you can successfully apply epoxy.

Sorry you hadn't read about it here years ago. Of course, sadly, now you know. Experience can be an effective but harsh teacher.

.............

Tom, I knew the poly thread was treated but I guess hadn't given any thought to metallics. Won't make that mistake again.

I know Madeira and Hjemmingworht metallics are both silicone'd, Sulky I did not know and I have a couple of spools of it. IT really varies form batch to batch, some Hemmingworth threads were fine, and others it was like the thread was made out of silicone.

I don't know what your plan of action is now, but it is possible that you can apply a coat of CP and then refinish with epoxy and be okay.

............

This isn't a complete cure for thread with silicone, but it does help. Take about 4 feet of the same thread (sulky) and add it to your epoxy as you mix it, leave the thread in the mix as you apply it to the thread as well. The silicone on the tread helps to acclimate the epoxy to the silicone and it doesn't fish eye as much as the untreated epoxy. I have had several wraps using sulky and maderia that had no fish eyes without cp, and several that had some fish eyeing, but it was better than with out the thread in the mix. I don't like to use cp on guide wraps, but don't have a lot of non-sewing thread so I use a lot of maderia with out cp and have few problems when I use silicon treated thread in the epoxy.

Thank for all of your feedback. I didn't apply what I've read about poly Sulky/Maderia over to metallics but makes sense as both kinds are to be used in a sewing machine. I didn't know that it would require four feet of thread to "neutralize" the silicone, thanks for that one Mark. I probably would have used four inches.

All is well now. I've stripped off the lumpy under wrap, CP'ed the new wrap, put four feet of the same thread in the cup and reapplied a thin layer. It's now several hours after application and the wrap looks smooth and level as it should be.

Thanks again.

Hi Mike,
When I've used that method with madeira I only used about four pieces around one inch long and didn't see any fisheyes. By adding thread you are adding silicon and that makes the surface tension the same as the wrap and therefore no fisheyes.
Mark, I've been using cp on all my guides wraps no matter what sort of thread and never had any issues with a thread problem in over 35 years. To each his own I suppose but it has never made any difference to me apart from a bit of extra time which is well worth it for madeira for the excellent colours available.

ESFNEM Col
Port Kembla, NSW
Australia

I have been using sulky metallics for years (metallics starting with 142) and never use color preserver and have not had an issue. Did you use the Sulky metallics starting in 142? I do however check for bubbles and "flame" as needed before i leave the room. I also have never stripped off line. Is this something new Sulky has started using silicone in metalic "142"?


Dan Grulke

Dan, the number is 143-7004.

I have been using floriani... Both metallic and non metallic with great results. I get it from my local embroidery shop in about any color or combination I can think of. The price is great and the stuff gives me great results. Maybe give it a shot

That would be the problem you need to use the "142" series. I have a spool close to 7004 in 142 series. Do you want me to send it to you so you can finish your job? If so shoot me an e-mail.

Dan

I was going to say, I've used Sulky metallic threads in the 142 series without CP forever with excellent results