A friend asked me to build a musky rod for him, a first for me. He wanted a two piece St Croix if possible, so I found that a 2M70MH2 would meet his needs. Where this guy even heard of a spiral wrap is beyond me but that's what he wants. My plan was to use AMT ringlock/nanoplasma double foot, starting with a 20, then 3 10's for the transition guides and then 8s out to the 8 tip. He also wants an exposed rod reel seat, so I was planning on using the Fugi ECSM or Pac Bay GB17C. Will this setup work ok? Any suggestions or cautions?

Thanks a lot, Jeff Frei

also, will A thread be ok or should I go to D?



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 02/06/2012 11:37AM by Jeff Frei.

Jeff,
I would ask some very serious questions to the client about his choices.

Ask him, if at all possible to try musky fishing with a spiral wrap and also an exposed reel seat.

For what you are doing, I would think that both choices would end up making the person quite unhappy.

With all of the figure 8 in the water with the tip fishing, tends to make the spiral wrap a poor choice for the rod.
With the hundreds of cast done every day with a musky rod, as well as the heavy action of the rod and its use - tends to make the exposed reel seat another poor choice.

You can use, A, B, C, or D thread. Us the one that suits you. Many folks who build a lot of musky rods use C thread for a nice balance of thread size and strength.

If in doubt, you might call Lonnie at Thorne Bothers in Minneapolis. He and his group build hundreds of Musky rods every year. Have a nice chat with him and then reach your own conclusions.

The rod that you are proposing would work. It is a matter of how well it would work.

-------------
In addition, I have had two different clients for whom I built Musky rods with a spiral wrap because it was what they wanted. After a month of use, both clients came back to me and asked me to rewrap the rod in a conventional format. Both clients ended up being very happy with the conventional wrap on the rods after the rework.

Good luck
REW

My client likes his 8' spiraled cowbell rod just fine. That's not a problem.

I do agree with Roger on the split seat. No need for sensitivity when a musky strikes.

_________________________________________
"Angling is extremely time consuming.
That's sort of the whole point." - Thomas McGuane

Holy cow! Glad that I asked.

Thanks Roger.

and Chuck



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 02/06/2012 12:47PM by Jeff Frei.

Jeff,

I tend to build alot of musky rods and I think you're on the right track but I'll make a few suggestions.

First, like the other guys said, I would not recommend a split seat.

Second, I would match the lures he'll be throwing to the rod. A 7' rod is pretty short for a musky stick but it's easy to extend to a longer length if that's what he wants. Tackle Industries is coming out with a 9' 2 piece rod and James is working on getting blanks for custom builders, I have a batch of his 9' single piece blanks on the way.

Third, you shouldn't have any issues with a spiral wrap. Not sure why it would make a difference on a figure 8?? You're going to hear suggestions both ways on spiral wraps, just build it the way the client wants.

Fourth, make your transition faster with your guides. I would suggest 16, 12, 8's to the tip. If the guy uses the foregrip alot, start with a 20.

jeremy

the exposed blank seat that I was going to use was not the two piece but the casting seat with the little cutout on the bottom if that makes any difference. I agree with all of you in that, if you have piqued the interest of a musky you will know it... with or without the little window. I believe that he saw it on a musky rod at Cabelas and liked it without actually fishing with one. The man is a good friend and I can easily talk him out of either the spiral or the exposed grip but I would still like to hear what others, that have more experience than me have to say. I would like to build him the best rod that I can for the money, which is an issue here. The 7' St Croix is $115. Jewelry $85. $200 total and that puts him right where he wants to be. Free labor on this one, another "practice rod" if you will.

As far as matching the lure, St Croix calls this the "all purpose" musky blank (SCII). The lure specific blanks (SCIV) whether it be stickbait, jerk bait, bucktail or whatever are in the $200-$265 area, a little pricey for an occational weekend jaunt.

As I have already said, this is a first for me and that's why I have turned to you guys and I thank you all for your help.

Jeff

Oh, my bad. One-piece exposed is just fine.

_________________________________________
"Angling is extremely time consuming.
That's sort of the whole point." - Thomas McGuane

Jeremy,
The thing that I have found for both Bass rods, as well as Musky rods; that for "tip down" presentations - the use of a conventional casting guide setup simply works better for the fishing than the spiral wrapped rod.

i.e. Much of the fishin is done off the top side of the rod. Hence the nice smooth action with the conventional casting tip on the top of the blank.

If one does not use the rod as a jerk bait, if one does not do any figure 8's with the tip down, if one uses the rod only for a conventional cast, tip up presentation; then the spiral wrap would work fine and perhaps even better than the conventional wrap.

The spiral wrap will work for both tip up, as well as tip down presentations in the same way that a conventional wrap will work all right for a tip up or a tip down presentation.

It is just that if much of the fishing is going to be off of either the top or bottom of the rod, it is nice to have the tip on that side of the rod.

Good luck
Roger

Which side is up when you set the hook on 50" fish? ;) And when you're fighting it? A spiral wrap is at it's best on a big fish rod.

_________________________________________
"Angling is extremely time consuming.
That's sort of the whole point." - Thomas McGuane



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 02/06/2012 03:56PM by Chuck Mills.

I would like the spiral wrap

Seems to me that a Conventional would only move the -- twisting factor -- from one side to the other on that Figure 8.

With the spiral it would be just as a spin and the guides would take the stress instead of the blank

Not a big fan of split seats

Bill - willierods.com

A thread is fine. I agree with Jeremy on the guides. I used double foot 6mm running guides on the last one.

Chuck

_________________________________________
"Angling is extremely time consuming.
That's sort of the whole point." - Thomas McGuane

Prep the guides well
A nice taper to the guide feet will help a lot

Bill - willierods.com

I built and fished the heck out of a musky rod last year with #6 runners and tip top I am using 85# braid and never had an issue. You can put a small bead ahead of the leader to keep it from going in the tip top if it is a concern.

I would also second that a 7' is short. I built a 8'6" and have a 9ft on the bench to build next.

Best of luck.

Eric

Roger,

I'm just curious as to why a conventional build is wanted when you figure 8's your baits? Isn't your rod moving 360 degrees in a circle or oval? If so, how can it matter whether the guides are on the top or bottom of the blank? They are still going to get rotated in a circle.

My personal preference is spiral wrapping musky rods. It doesn't matter to me where the guides are when I'm casting and retrieving lures. What matters is, where are the guides when you are fighting a 30lb fish? (LOL, I say that like I've caught a 30lb musky...I haven't yet)

jeremy

Jeremy,
Normally, when doing figure 8's, the rod is movingdownedd. Hence the nice feel to the rod with the line coming off of the bottom of the tip guide.

The same is true when using the same rod for Jerk baits.

As I said earlier, I have had two clients who had spiral wrapped rods, returned for a conventional rebuild.

When I asked why- it was the same answer for both clients.

The rod felt better with the conventional wrap when doin8'sfigure 8s and with jerk baits.

Good luck
Roger

Guys- thanks for all of your input. This has been much more informative than I expected. I appreciate all of your help.

Jeff

Roger,

Did your clients say specifically what it was they didn't like about the feel? I haven't really noticed a difference either way. Like I said, to me, I build spiral wraps for fighting fish, not casting and retrieving lures.

Please don't read my response as argumentative. I'm just looking to learn. Sometimes things can be taken the wrong way when read without the benefit of hearing the person's voice.

thanks,
jeremy

I have built several musky rods and all of them except for two for a friend have been spiral wrapped. The only reason he didn't go spiral is because of how it looks. I just finished up a 9 foot SCIV Big Nasty for another guy with a Fuji ECSM blank exposed seat, split rear grip, no fore grip, with micro single foot guides. We'll see how the guides hold up, I have fished my own 8 footer with micros for the past year and it held up just fine... In fact, I landed my personal best on the 8 footer with micros while throwing a bucktail. The fish was a 53.25" with a 25.5" girth. I don't really see any reason that the guides won't hold up... As far as figure 8's go, a spiral wrapped rod will eliminate line rubbing the blank, which may fatigue the line over time, and will eliminate blank twist when the monster does decide to eat boat side!

Jeremy,
NO reason really given.

When the rods were rebuilt, happy comments a month later from both folks.

I also fish with for Musky from time to time and I do agree with the clients comments.

I just prefer the overall feel casting, and action of the conventionally wrapped rods for this applicaiton.

I do keep several spiral wrapped rods that I use all of the time for applications that do not entail casting. For those applications, I have been more than pleased with the rods.

I can't really put my finger on it, but if I pick up a casting rod that I am going to be using for a lot of casting my preference every time will be for a conventionally wrapped rod.

Take care
Roger