What is your take on using Madeira for guide wraps? I have heard a couple of cons for it, but is anyone else using it?

I have a lot of that Madeira, and the colors are really nice, the thing is with me is that they fuzz up a lot when I am wrapping, I don't know if it is the thread it self or just the way I am wrapping, I just flame it quickly to get all the fuzz off it works really good, they say that it needs cp, but the only colors that need it to me are the bright colors, the dark colors do good without the cp. good wraps!

I bought a wad of it when I found it for $2.10 on the net. I have heard concerns of its strength, but I don't know from personal experience. I have just done a test tiger with it and liked it other than the forever and a day bubble release for me that left some minor eyes on the first coat.

I thought I had problems and contamination somewhere when I was using it. turns out, it was the thread itself that was the problem. Some folks say that if you put a few clippings in the finish when you mix it, there will be no problem, and that it what I experienced, but I'd rather not have to juice up my finish with thread clippings when other threads work better for me without any fisheye problems.

It is suitable for guide wraps as long as you are able to work with it. I cannot use it on guide wraps, and I will no longer be using it for underwraps on guide wraps either. Even when I use CP on the guide wrap, it still fisheyes. IT is difficult to wrap because it is so thin and stretchy, on the bigger guides (size 16 & 20) it is a real pain to keep teh threads packed together as you wrap up the guide foot. The other major prolbem I hae with it, and this happend recently to me & I'm re-wrapping a rod for free as a result - is teh epoxy turns white and seems to flake or lift off. I guess the CP prevnts the epoxy form soaking in and when the rod is fished teh epoxy pulls away from teh thread and it turns opaque white. I know others who have this happen to them, and others who dont' have any of the issues I have. So the best thing you can do is test it and see if it works for you.

For Dec WRaps ther eis nothing better, it's all I use. If you want to take the easy way out when selecting colors, I have shade packs available for 19 different colors: [northeastrodbuilders.com]

Isnt epoxy peeling off threads an issue in general with CP no matter the thread brand?

Strong wraps, calm seas
Derek

Thanks Billy. I have wandered around the NERBs site and seen the packs. I plan on getting up with you on some EVA when I get back in the country. Unless you can meet me at the gate in Newark for a hand off. But I don't think TSA will oblige that.

Derek, I cannot say for sure since I never use CP other than on Dec WRaps and the few times when I used Maderia as a guide wrap. I know a lot of people do use CP, and the best thing ANYONE can do is to try and and see how it works for them. I will say 100% that if you properly apply CP & Epoxy to a Dec Wrap, you will not have any blotching and the epoxy will not turn white and flake/peel off. That's not the issue here htough.

Garey, With the cost of tolls and gashaving it shipped will be a lot mor ecost effective, lol.

I've been using it for about 4 years & have never had a problem .Although I only build around 15-20 rods per year & most of them are light to medium spinning rods . If I have to build a 10 or 20 kg stick then I use the speciality rod threads in "C"or "D". If I were trying to make a living out of rod building then I would use the speciality threads due to the faster time of wrapping .As Billy said they can be a bit difficult to pack so I have to stop & pack a couple of times on each guide . I use U40 color Lock2 for CP 2 coats & Diamond D2 epoxy & have had no problems whatsoever to date.

Regards Baz

Bundeena NSW

Hi Gary,
I've been using Madeira for guide wraps for several years now and have never had a problem with strength or any guides pull out. I've built ultra lights to 50lb game rods with it without an issue. Did some test wraps with some guides and they were very difficult to pull out with a pair of pliers. I use about a 1/4 more tension than with regular rod building thread to over come the stretch. The thread contains silicon for use in embroidery machines and it will cause fisheyes in the finish. It can be overcome with the use of a good quality cp, I use three coats, or by putting a few pieces of thread in the finish mix. The lighter colours will turn translucent if you don't use cp.
Ive been using it for so long now that if I go back to regular thread it feels foreign. You just need to get used to using it. The colour selection is terrific and you can come up with some great combinations.

ESFNEM Col
Port Kembla, NSW
Australia

What do the thread clippings in the finish contribute to the outcome I wonder?

Pesco Ergo Sum

Hi Bruce,
Pieces of thread in the finish mix make the surface tension the same and it prevents fisheyes. Silicon/wax is the active ingredient in painters fisheye prevention methods. It works as I've tried it on some test wraps. The lighter colours turn translucent without cp but the darker colours remain the same.

ESFNEM Col
Port Kembla, NSW
Australia

I probaly use Madiera or Trilobal polyestoe thread over 90% of the time on all wraps, including guide wraps. I do use CP. Have never had a problem but I DON"t do the big salt sticks.

Mike (Southgate, MI)
If I don't want to, I don't have to and nobody can make me (except my wife) cuz I'm RETIRED!!

How much thread do you need to use in the epoxy mix for it to work?

Hi Paul,
I used three pieces about 2 inches long and I didn't get any fisheyes. One thing I've noticed with Madeira is that some of the thread sometimes has a lot of silicon on it and other parts you can't see it so I suppose it depends on the bit you get.

ESFNEM Col
Port Kembla, NSW
Australia

Thanks for the replies fellas.

It's difficult for me to undertand how same piece of thread in epoxy mix can prevent fisheyes.
If i understand after the mix you put same little piece of madeira in and as Mr Col saied these make the surface tension the same and it prevents fisheyes.
Be patient...explane me....

No need for an explanation. Try it yourself and see what happens, that's all that matters. If it works who cares why...it works. If it doesn't who cares why they say it works, for you it doesn't work.

Hi Cosimo,
By adding thread to the finish mix you are adding silicon to it and the surface tension will be the same as the wraps. Do what Billy suggests and give it a try on a test wrap and you will see for yourself. I'm not a fan of the translucent look with the light colours so I haven't done it on a rod but it worked well for me on a test wrap.

ESFNEM Col
Port Kembla, NSW
Australia