I have seen the carrot sticks with the micro guides and they apparently still have not adopted the concept of the spiral wrap for the baitcasting-type reels. I did notice that they have 12 micro guides, including tip-top, on a 7' rod.

Is this customary for this type of set-up?

I want to incorporate the spiral wrap so would I need less guides in this instance? Any suggestions on a 7" blank on my selection of sizes for a micro guide spiral wrap?

Any help would be greatly appreciated Thx!

Depending on which spiral method you use, will dertermine how many guides you will eventually use. Lots of the manufactured rods seem to have too many micros on them, at least in my opinion. If it was conventional wrapped, I might use 1 or 2 more than the standard 1 for every foot + tip. If you do a simple spiral, then you would be adding one more guide, the bumper guide. If you are doing more of a revolver spiral, then you are using 4 guides to get from top to bottom.

Mike, I planned on using one guide for the transition......What size would you start with for your 1st guide?

Dave,
Even when using micros, I would use a more conventional sized guide for the first couple of guides. The important one is the first guide so that its size and position does not slow the cast or impede the retreive.

Basically when using a micro spiral, I would be using about the same number of guides on a blank as if I were using spinning guides on the rod. Since the line will be on the underside of the rod for the bulk of the rod, there is no reason to have any more guides than to get a reasonable match for the line flow to match the curve of the loaded rod.

So, if this were a 7 foot spiral wrapped rod, I would likely be using either 7 or 8 guides.

Take care.
Roger

p.s.
Remember, when you are retreiving your line, your line will be moving back and forth across the width of the reel. It is nice to have the butt guide of a size so that as the line moves across the reel, the line angle does not become so great as to cause excessive drag when retreiving.

Good luck
Roger

Dave;
I would suggest not using a micro for the transition guide when employing the simple wrap.
Especially if you intend to use anything over 10lb mono or floro lines

[rodbuilding.org]

Roger

Is right on The 180 are as a spinning rod - One guide per foot pluss one ---- To Start Static testing will tell you
I put my 180 guides on Then run line from the reel
The line will tell you where the guides go

I do not use any type of Spiral wrap just let the rod and line let you know what you need

usually three to the 180

But always adjust to fit and make sure the reel does not load on one side

Bill - willierods.com

I tend to use a 6 or 5 double foot for the start and I like more of the revolver type of setup. I have tried the simple, but something just does not seem to work well for me. I then use 3's out to the tip.

I use a #4 to start then spiral all the way to the tip top. Have been doing this for years with no problems and no complaints from my customers. A static test is a must on all spiral wrapped rods, the small action changes will define how many and where the guides should be.

I always start out with 8 guides, and at times have to add one. Have never went down though. Hope this helps.

I would like to know why you are building a spiral wrapped using micros? The major advantage of the spiral was to eliminate torque on the rod. With the micros being so close to the blank there isn't a lot of torque to eliminate. I think that most of the guys that are using micros have stopped wrapping spirals as there was no real advantage.

I mabe wrong on this so any one who whishes to chime in go for it.

Rolly Beenen
Rovic Custom Rods

I like the spiral with micros, not so much for torque, but for keeping the line off the blank. That is why the Carrot sticks have so many guides. With the low frames, you have to put a bunch of guides on there to keep the line off the blank, or to keep it from passing below blank when the rod is flexed. Spiraling the guides to the bottom eliminates that problem.

If the line rubbed too long on the carrot stick blank, would it start to smell like carrot soup? A friend of mine bought one when they first came out, and he told me it was more sensitive because it was made entirely of carrot fibers. ha ha.

Dave,

Assuming that you are working with typical bass/inshore sized reels (Curado 200 or smaller size). I really like to use a 6mm double foot, then 5, 4, 3s to the tip for my spiral wraps. I also prefer to use the Batson micros for spiral wrapping, as they keep the line a little further off the blank through the transition. I really like a slow spiral. It may require 3 or 4 transition guides (space them according to a static test) to get to the bottom, but the results have been good to me. There will be a little side loading, but on a bass/inshore type rod, it's not much of an issue.

For the number of guides, you don't require any more guides than you would normally use with larger guides to distribute the load along the blank. Since the guides sit so close to the blank, you may find that the line path doesn't look as nice as it does with larger guides. What I find is that I typically use L in feet + 2 guides when working with micros in a spiral wrap. I get a line path that looks good, the line control that I want, and only pay a marginal weight penalty, all the while coming in with a guide train that weighs only a fraction of a conventional guide train. Your mileage may vary.

Joe

I have built several bass specific micro spirals including a swim bait rod and flipping stick. I find no issues using this setup (simple/bumper) and pick the first three guides just tall enough to prevent the line from dragging on the blank. It does not take a very big guide to work and work well. If you have not read Rich Forehan's last article in RM you need to. Some of the stuff I see on mini guides and spiral wraps is pretty far out there. I find that redoing a rod with mini guides can really make a difference. I redid my P7000 with mini's and it really woke the blank up! As Rich said there is no reason not to use the spiral and I think the mini giudes fit right in.

Bill,
Actually there is one reason to NOT use the spiral on some rods for some specific fishermen.

That is where the rod is going to be used specifically for a jerk bait rod, a figure 8 rod, or other rod, where the bulk of the fishing is done from the top side of the rod. In this case, many fishermen much prefer the use of a conven tionally wrapped casting rod.

It is not to say that a spiral rod won't work for this application, because it will. It is just the preference for many fishermen who fish this style rods prefer the use of a convential wrapped casting rods.

Roger

Rolly;
" I think that most of the guys that are using micros have stopped wrapping spirals as there was no real advantage."

That is quite an assumption on both counts!
There may be some who used to do spirals who no longer do with micros's , but personally have only had couple of builders tell me they have stopped. And they are still advantages to micro spirals over conventional setups. (although you will find builders that argue either side).

I've built every bait-caster micro rod for the last 5 years spiral, including jerk bait rods,
Don't fish for or build muskie stuff so don't know about figure 8 rods.

The only reason I can see not to use a spiral setup is on spinning rods.

I wrap spirals when using 5's and up but when using 4's and smaller i wrap them conventional. There is enough push back by my customers that it's not worth arguing about.

Rolly Beenen
Rovic Custom Rods



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 09/08/2011 07:39AM by Rolly Beenen.