What method do you recommend for cementing a tip top to a blank using heat-sensitive ferrule cement? I'm especially interested in hints about small tip-tops (4 & 4.5).

I slice very small strips of the adhesive and pack them into the tip top. then just a little heat on the tube and it's good to go.

I heat the glue stick, then swipe the tiptop tube against it, smearing glue into the tube opening. Then very briefly heat the tube and push it onto the rod blank.

...........

If the tip top is painted black be sure to run a small brush or file inside first

Click on the arrow in this link to see a very good demo.

Roger I still think you could sell 100,000 miles of 5/64 high temp hot melt preformed sticks!

The ones you gave me at the show for trial were the Cats Meow!

[www.flexcoat.com]

Gon Fishn



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 05/10/2011 02:21PM by Bill Stevens.

I was hoping for a suggestion for a heat source - flame or indirect - and tips on how to best judge when sufficient heat was applied to saturate the tip top to blank bond.

I use hot melt glue inserted IN the tube. I use a craft glue gun to make a lot of strips [www.rodbuilding.org] and then just stick one in the tip tube, break off what need, hit with a lighter and slide on the rod. The problem with epoxy is the difficulty in replacing tips.

Mike (Southgate, MI)
If I don't want to, I don't have to and nobody can make me (except my wife) cuz I'm RETIRED!!



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 05/11/2011 02:37PM by Mike Barkley.

Phil.
After having issues with a couple of tips coming loose, I have changed my gluing method to the following:
1. I use an alcohol burner to heat the glue stick.
2. With the rod turning in the wrapper, I do a full glue wrap around the tip of the rod.
3. I then heat the tip, and with the heated glue stick, insert the glue stick into the tip for glue on the inside of the tip.
4. Then, I apply heat to the tip, the tip top and assemble.
5. While everything is still flexible, I use a craft stick on the spinning tip to wipe off the excess glue.
6. I double check the alignment and I am done.

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In previous times, before getting the tip well whetted with the glue, I had a couple of tips come loose. It just seems that it is difficult to get the rod tip well whetted with cement, if the cement is not applied to the tip by itself first. But since going to this method, I have had 0 failures with tips.

Good luck
Roger

I hold mine over an alcohol burner, get it melted then run a dubbing needle though it creating a thick "string" on the bottom side of the needle. Give it a few seconds to cool then peel it off the needle, roll a little and press it down into the tube. Then heat the tube until I see the glue melt and start to "bubble out" and slide the top on the blank. Experimented with a bunch of different ways but this worked the best for me.

Indirect flame. I use an alcohol burner or candle and hold it above the flame, just enough to melt the glue in the tip, the press on and wipe off excess glue.

David Dosser
Coshocton, OH

I no longer use hot melt glue because I've had several tips loosen and rotate when left in a car or truck.
I use a red thermal melt stick used for adhering points to arrow shafts.
It melts at a higher temp. than regular or Flexcoat hot melt.
Put some in the tube, heat and apply to rod.

Two part 5 minute rod building epoxy. Works EVERY time and never fails.

Need to replace a tip top? Just heat it and pull, comes right off.

DR

Steven Garvey:

Would you please provide the exact product name and type you are using.

Thanks

I've never had one come loose in the heat, even when I lived in Florida or Texas, when tip-top glue like Fuji or Flexcoat or even hot-melt glue was used for installation except on cheap rods purchased at the big store that sells everything.

David Dosser
Coshocton, OH

Bill all I can read is "Fuse-Tite Cement". It's a 1/2" dia. stick, got a light blue wrapper and the glue
itself is a redish clay color. It is hard, you can't dig you're fingernail into it.
I bought it years ago, don't remember where and only have about 3/4" left.

I think I've seen that at a local outdoor store here that sells guns, bows etc. I'll check next time I go and if I see it I'll take a picture of it.

David Dosser
Coshocton, OH

Thanks Steve:

The melting point for some of the hot melt for arrows is extremely high - some of stuff lists temps above 1,000 F. The arrow guys are quite knowledgable about the stuff they use on carbon tips. Some of the products specifically say it can not be removed, by heating, without damaging the carbon arrow.

The Flexcoat hot melt was designed for fishing rods and is used by most production companies. When the proper size tip is installed with the hot melt in the proper way it will stay.

The melting point of the Flexcoat adhesive was selected to insure against blank damage during intiial installation or when a repair was needed.

One of the advantages of the Flexcoat adhesive is the ease of removal of a damaged tip on small diameter blanks with minimal chance of damage.

Some tournament fishermen request extra tops to keep with them while on the tournament trail. They fix them when a ring or frame is damange themselves. I would never take the chance of one of my customers removing a tip top installed with epoxy.

I have damaged tip tips during removal that were installed with epoxy both on glass and graphite rods -

There is some very good information in the Internet about hot melt use - one interesting thing noted for all - maximum bond strength is diminished each time the material is heated to the melting point. Get the tip on with the fewest heatings cycles as possible. It seems to me the fewest number of heatings is done with putting the material in the tube and heating it - sliding in place - just like is shown on the Flexcoat video. One heating will provide the maximun strength of bond.

Rodbuilders install tip tops to a blank that is stationary (not spinning) and allow any excess to "harden" for a few seconds prior to popping the cooled excess off with the fingers. I would think the removal of excess hot melt with a craft stick while spinning woud be impossible without missalignment of the tip top. .



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 05/11/2011 07:47PM by Bill Stevens.

I just use a lighter to heat the stuff, it seems to melt fairly easily.
Typically I put some in the tube heat and apply to rod..
Then I just use a bit of heat from the lighter if I have to adjust or remove it.
No long heating required where it would effect the blank.

personally im with the glue stuffers. i heat up my fuji glue stik with a bic lighter, then wipe the surface of my index finger along the heated patch of glue, creating a thin film on my skin. i then rool up the film, stuff the roll into the tube heat until overflow then insert the blank. minimal heating to align. i dont try to align until the initial contact is 100%. and i have removed the excess glue. i just get it close at first.

Bill Stevens Wrote:
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> Rodbuilders install tip tops to a blank that is
> stationary (not spinning) and allow any excess to
> "harden" for a few seconds prior to popping the
> cooled excess off with the fingers. I would think
> the removal of excess hot melt with a craft stick
> while spinning woud be impossible without
> missalignment of the tip top. .

This one had me scratching my head. I agree with Bill. If the glue is soft enough to be removed with a craft stick, odds are that the tip will shift. Seems like this method would just smear glue around. It's much easier to pop off the excess later. Done right, there is no glue evidence.

_________________________________________
"Angling is extremely time consuming.
That's sort of the whole point." - Thomas McGuane

Chuck,
I use the craft stick to remove any excess glue with the material soft.
After the excess glue has been removed so there is not a trace, I will align the tip - reheating slightly if necessary.

Using a craft stick does not burn your finger as if you used your finger to remove the excess glue. (don't ask how I know that)

The entire reason that I have migrated to coating the tip with cement before applying the tip, is that is simply works better for me.

It seemed that when just putting finish on the inside of the tip, there would be some tip tops and some rod tips, where the rod tip did not actually get coated with cement. It seemed that the cement would just simply push by the tip without actually sticking. Thus the need to go to a different system. Never a failure since insuring that the tip is well coated before applying the tip top with a bit of cement on the inside.

Good luck
Roger