have any of you having hard time with bubbles and mico bubbles, I get the carbon on the the foam cor and I put on the epoxy on and I take the heat gun to it but then it seem like theres more bubbles then I stared with and if there is a better stuff out there to use I would like to know thank you

"I take the heat gun to it" Why are you taking the heat gun to the epoxy?? How much heat are you adding? To much heat can cause the epoxy to almost froth with bubbles. Don't know if that is your problem, but could be!

Mike (Southgate, MI)
If I don't want to, I don't have to and nobody can make me (except my wife) cuz I'm RETIRED!!

to get the bubbles out I don't want bubbles in the grip win you sand and polish you get holes

The foam under core is full of air pockets as is any foam, and when you are heating the carbon
the foam is getting to hot, causing the air in the foam to expand the only place for it to go is out the carbon skin where it is trapped by the epoxy causing more bubbles then you started with.

Same thing will happen if you use heat shrink sleeving and get things hot, causing the air to boil through the epoxy messing up the carbon skin.

so what do I do to not get bubbes I have done 3 handles and all them has bubbles need help I don't know want to do I want to master I don't like to give up on this because it is get looking grip

Riley Rods has the foam core handle sequence on his site. Look that over and follow it.

I had a problem with bubbles on one handle I did with the heat shrink. I simply got it too hot, and as the air expands in the core it has to go somewhere, just like Steve said.

_________________________________________
"Angling is extremely time consuming.
That's sort of the whole point." - Thomas McGuane

Easy on the heat or you can get bubbles for a couple of reasons.

What I've been doing is after wetting, I'll take a brush and go lengthways like I do on long buttwraps to even the epoxy and wick any excess. I do this while it's spinning on my dryer. So far only doing textured grips, so light finish. But on heavier coats if heat is needed, use with care.

I seal my cores first, let dry, then tie up the material with zip ties. I don't do the wet the core/slide the material on deal. Seem to get better end finish this way that I don't have to hide with a big winding check or end cap.

Credit to Lance for the zip tie approach.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 02/22/2011 11:53PM by Bob Mankin.

NO HEAT, it does not help! Be sure to seal the foam core before sliding the carbon sleeve on. Some use sanding sealer or even a thin coat of epoxy, let it dry or cure before going on. This will keep air from escaping from the foam.

Then when applying the epoxy, flow it on, NOT A LOT OF BRUSHING! I do not use the shrink sleeve method, so I apply multiple coats of epoxy, the number depending upon how smooth or textured I want the finished grip.

Avoid the heat!

Wipe on a super thin coating of resin, super thin! You don't want enough resin on the core that it will saturate the fibers, just enough to stick the sleeve to the foam. I gave up trying to seal all of the tiny pockets in the core. Apply sleeve and zip tie one end. Pull tight while spiral wrapping with a 1 to 1 1/2 strip of saran wrap. After the resin is cured, remove the saran wrap. All fibers should be dry on the outside. Then, very slowly wet out the fiber sleeve. Go back over it a couple times and make sure it's really wet. Let cure, sand and recoat, repeat if needed. After coating, let cure in a cool place.

This is my method and has pretty much eliminated bubbles. It's kinda the same way blanks are constructed. The saran wrap trick has changed everything for me. No heat due to heat shrink tubing, you can see what's happening underneath, and it flattens out the ridge where the sleeve was folded. It's maybe a little unorthodox but it works. Email if you have questions.

Steve

Steve, how do you keep the sleeve from moving around and getting the pattern crooked or twisted while you are spriraling the saran wrap around the grip. That is one of my pet peeves is when the sleeve isnt straight. I usually chuck the grip in the redo bin and save it for expirementing on or to use on one of my personal rods. I would love to eliminate the shrink tube as it has gotten expensive and it is easy to overcook things while shrinking it on. Im going to play your method a bit.

here check this out : [www.rileyrods.com]

Bill - willierods.com

I use a heat gun all the time to release bubbles. Lowest setting, constantly moving.

I only use the heat shrink when I need to speed up the process a bit. Don't like not being able to see the handle and then open it a few hours later to see a problem

I think Matt's biggest problem is starting out with the Heavy Grade Carbon and using a 1" brush to add additional epoxy after the lay-up. The regular (Light Grade) is by far the easiest and the best place to start.

Practice makes perfect and coming up with the method that works best for you.

Riley Rods-Hard Core Grips to Go!-----Carbon Fiber - Composite Grip Store-----Capt Mike's Blog-----No Excuses Fishing Charters

Heating the epoxy will tend to create micro bubbles. It causes the epoxy to "boil." Keep the heat gun away from your grip unless you're using the shrink wrap method. Removing bubbles only takes a very gentle amount of heat. Same with shrinking the wrap. Beyond a certain point you're going to create more bubbles than you remove.

...................

The heavier material definitely gave me a few fits the first time i used it also. But i really like the look of it expecially on a heavier duty rod. I still have problems with a few bubbles here and there also. Matt, one thing that seems to help me is to let the epoxy set a while to a thicker consistency before using the heat shrink. I put the grip in my turner and let it thicken up for an hour or so. (this will vary depending on which epoxy you are using obviously and the temp) keeping an eye out and trying to burst any bubbles along the way. When it is the consistency i like i will put the shrink tube on and then let it sit overnight.

One of the things I found is that the best tool to apply the laminating epoxy is a glove. I can work it into the carbon sleeve much better using my fingers than anything else I have found, and getting the sleeve completely wetted out is one of the most critical parts of the process.

Gee, it would be great if someone would do a seminar on this.... ;)

_________________________________________
"Angling is extremely time consuming.
That's sort of the whole point." - Thomas McGuane

MIke will be doing two seminars on the process.

.................

Hey mike tape your seminars I bet that you can make some exs money for the guys that can't go to the exso

Video taping isn't allowed. Sorry.

...........

Phil,

I use the saran wrap after the fiber sleeve is pulled tight and in place the best I can get it. The plastic wrap tucks the sleeve into any contours, corners and gets the ends tight to the mandrel. Since it's transparent, you can still slide the sleeve around a little after it's wrapped and still see what you're doing. Just work it gently with your thumbs.

Letting the grip cure in a cool place has really helped me too.

I think most problems come from not wetting the sleeve enough during the initial lamination. Air bubbles underneath will expand and blow a hole through the tacky resin. A heavy wet-out and going slow will push them out... I think. It's helped me anyway.

Also, I get the strips of saran wrap by chucking a whole roll in the lathe and holding a brand new razor blade to it. If you do it, Don't try teflon tape. It makes a ginormous mess peeling it off.