in the other post i wrote , i asked about micro guides for a muskie rod that will be used for throwing big swimbaits that will weigh up to a pound (16 oz.) . the rod will not be used for muskies as it will be used for bass . the blank i want this rod made on is the St.Croix 4M86XHF (the bigdawg blank rated 4-10 oz. but can throw up to 18 oz. baits ) and was looking to go with micros on it but you guys advised me to go with 6 mm flyguides after the transition (the rod will be wrapped in a revolver wrap) so my question is will these guides (the 6mm) hold up to the baits weight ???

thanks , Peter

The weight of the baits wouldn't be the issue unless you are using a spectra/mono connection or even an Albright knot to connect to a shock leader. Then,it would seem to matter how big the connection is and whether or not it will pass through your guides without catching on the rings. Just my 2 cents worth.
Just don't forget the Forhan locking wrap!



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 06/04/2010 07:50PM by Chuck McIntyre.

Yes. recommend you use 25 or 30 lb. mono only (no spectra or Floro lines) and a quality reel without a line guide.

Yes. recommend you use 25 or 30 lb. mono only (no spectra or Floro lines) and a quality reel without a line guide.

Peter-

Once about 3 or 4 years ago I was building a bunch of heavy surf casting rods for shark fishing from the beach. At the time, I lived a very short walk from a park with about a 5 acre lake in it. I would often walk down to the lake to test cast rods, and this was especially helpful with surf rods - testing the shock leader knots I could (and couldn't pass), figuring out guide set ups, etc.

Anyway, the heaviest one I built was a really heavy 14' Lami...don't remember all the specs, but I was testing with between 2 and 2.5 lbs. of weight when test casting. To be clear, that is pounds not ounces. My guides were taped on with about two turns of regular cheapo masking tape to hold them in place. I am no kind of world class surf caster, but I was throwing 2 lbs of weight between 80 and 100 yards with the guides simply taped on. And they never even moved. Defies logic, right? But it's true - didn't even stretch the tape.

Now, these guides were heavier than 6s (16s to be specific) but the point is that they really don't experience extreme pressure, torque or dead lift forces. QUALITY size 6 guides will give you no problems as long as they will pass your knots. That being said, the best way to figure out if what you are thinking about will work is to TRY IT. Wrap them on there and don't finish them or tape them on and take them to the lake with the reel, line and lure(s) you expect to use. A little bit of practical testing will teach you more than hours of reading posts. No offense intended to all the extremely knowledgeable folks kind enough to share their collective wisdom here.

Great blank and I think you'll be pleased. Post some pics and let us know how you make out. Good luck!

Bill

Richard Forhan Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Yes. recommend you use 25 or 30 lb. mono only (no
> spectra or Floro lines) and a quality reel without
> a line guide.


i'm gonna be using 30-40 lb. Izorline XXX or if i can get it , 30 lb. Gamma co-poly on a Revo Toro Winch . i don't use flourocarbon lines with big baits and definitely not gonna use braid !!!

Bill Falconer Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Peter-
>
> Once about 3 or 4 years ago I was building a bunch
> of heavy surf casting rods for shark fishing from
> the beach. At the time, I lived a very short walk
> from a park with about a 5 acre lake in it. I
> would often walk down to the lake to test cast
> rods, and this was especially helpful with surf
> rods - testing the shock leader knots I could (and
> couldn't pass), figuring out guide set ups, etc.
>
> Anyway, the heaviest one I built was a really
> heavy 14' Lami...don't remember all the specs, but
> I was testing with between 2 and 2.5 lbs. of
> weight when test casting. To be clear, that is
> pounds not ounces. My guides were taped on with
> about two turns of regular cheapo masking tape to
> hold them in place. I am no kind of world class
> surf caster, but I was throwing 2 lbs of weight
> between 80 and 100 yards with the guides simply
> taped on. And they never even moved. Defies
> logic, right? But it's true - didn't even stretch
> the tape.
>
> Now, these guides were heavier than 6s (16s to be
> specific) but the point is that they really don't
> experience extreme pressure, torque or dead lift
> forces. QUALITY size 6 guides will give you no
> problems as long as they will pass your knots.
> That being said, the best way to figure out if
> what you are thinking about will work is to TRY
> IT. Wrap them on there and don't finish them or
> tape them on and take them to the lake with the
> reel, line and lure(s) you expect to use. A
> little bit of practical testing will teach you
> more than hours of reading posts. No offense
> intended to all the extremely knowledgeable folks
> kind enough to share their collective wisdom here.
>
>
> Great blank and I think you'll be pleased. Post
> some pics and let us know how you make out. Good
> luck!
>
> Bill


thanks for that post !!! my concerns are out the window !! i wish i could build rods , i am gonna have this rod made by someone . i really want to learn this awesome craft/art , i can't wait till Mudhole has some classes down here in San Diego !! i am going to go to the custom rod show in Orange county in October , really looking foward to it . thanks once again for the help , advice , and guidance on this , i appreciate it !!!

Peter quite interested in this thread.

The references to a rod for muskie may have me a little bit confused.

You say this rod is for bass - swim bait!

The swim baits I am familar with do not weigh one pound, 16 ounces.

Many bass swim bait rods are built with single foot micro guides.

If you come to the custom rod show next February in High Point you will see several swim bait bass rods built using micro guides

Peter, you have someone local who holds rod building classes every Wes at 7 PM. Beginners are welcome and you can bring your blanks/parts. Well worth the 90 minute drive IMHO.
Glenn's Tackle Shop
1145 Baker St.
Costa Mesa, CA 92626
714-957-1408 shop
714-726-1697 cell

IMHO a bigger/heavier rod is easier to build. The UL/fly rod stuff makes me feel like Mr. fumble fingers. You CAN do this and no special equipment is needed. Just keep the thread art simple the first time around. You can always cut the guides off and re-do at a later date and that is a skill you want to learn anyhow. Might not be a bad idea to build the first one on a cheaper blank.

Seems like a monster of a blank for bass. Overkill for albacore and I think it could handle yellowtail. If you could see yourself on a long range boat someday I'd be inclined to go with a double foot guide. Fuji msng and amtak virtus are nice choices. It isn't going to add that much weight and they will handle more abuse/accidents.

Russ in Hollywood, FL.

Bill Stevens Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Peter quite interested in this thread.
>
> The references to a rod for muskie may have me a
> little bit confused.
>
> You say this rod is for bass - swim bait!
>
> The swim baits I am familar with do not weigh one
> pound, 16 ounces.
>
> Many bass swim bait rods are built with single
> foot micro guides.
>
> If you come to the custom rod show next February
> in High Point you will see several swim bait bass
> rods built using micro guides


i am going to be getting some custom made swimbaits from Natesbaits , a muskie guy who is making swimbaits for bass , he has made some protos that weigh in at 17 oz. , they are 15 1/2" long , they are trout imitations . the trout that they stock in the lake i throw swimbaits at (Dixon lake) are a minimum of 14" and the big bass slurp them up . i am targeting BIG bass , hopefully in the 10-20 lb. range and a 15" trout is a nice meal for them !!! this bvlank i want built on (St.Croix big dawg) is the one he uses to throw these big baits with (plus all the HUGE muskie baits he normally throws ) .