After the blank, what are the very lightest components out there to use on a custom build? Or what will make the rod the very lightest it can possibly be?

What are the lightest guides on the market? Lightest grip material? Type of grip style? These are only a few examples of what I am looking for.

I am just curious on how a person would make a rod in the very lightest way manageable...

One thing that's often overlooked is the diameter of the butt end of the blank. The bigger the ID of the handle components, the lighter the handle.

Bobby Feazel

[www.shockwaverods.com]

Conventional wisdom will not open the box.

"Micro Guides" , Silk thread. Cork grip with the reel attached with thread instead of a reel seat. And a feather for embellishment.

Freddwhy (Rapt-Ryte)

Ryan where are you - what specific kind of rod - fishing for pleasure or cash - skill level of angler - how is durability condisered as opposed to performance.

The qualification of the lightest in all cases my get you in trouble.

I will have an eight foot cranking rod rated for 3/4 oz traps with me at the High Point event that weighs in at under three ounces total.

Endless correct answers and preferences.

The lightest way to build is to take your given blank and then add only what you need to accomplish what you want to do.

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So a size 20 seat is lighter than a size 16 seat?? It has a bigger ID.

How will the seat fit your hand. You also want comfort to fish all day.

Bill - willierods.com

John -

I don't know that Bobby meant components of that size - but use this perspective -

Weigh an ECS 12 and an ECS 14.5. The 14.5 will be lighter.

Weight the same piece of cork reamed for a .333" blank and then for a .625" diameter. OD is still same, same grip, but you've removed more internal material - so it's lighter.

Might be a chance the blank itself is lighter when built with thin walls, large diameter than a thick wall, thin diameter blank of the same length and power. I'd have to weigh some blanks to get that comparison.

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Ryan,
The lightest rod with a particular blank will be the one with a tip only - no guides, and then the reel taped to the bare blank.
If you can live with the peformance of the rod like that you won't get it any lighter.

Take care
Roger

What bobby is saying, and he is right on target, is that for a given handle and reel seat diameter a larger blank diameter will result in less material in the handle and reel seat and make the whole rod lighter. It is impossible to make a handle as light as the air inside the blank.

Reel seats are surprisingly heavy compared to other parts of the rod, especially blank exposed casting seats for small blank diameters. The difference in weight between a 9mm seat and a 13mm seat is substantial.

Foam core carbon skinned grips are the lightest way to make a handle. I have done several spinning rods using the carbon skinned handle to make a split Tennessee handle with about a 5 inch section to mount the reel either with tape or thread. By eliminating the conventional spinning reel seat I can eliminate almost a full ounce from the build, which is over half the entire weight added to the blank on most builds. It would be nice if we had a similar way to attach baitcasting reels.

Ryan,

I would add that using a skeleton or split reel seat, reduces a significant amount weight, and still gives you the convenience of being able to remove or swap out reels easily.
For me, weight reduction becomes an overall theme, at every step of the build.
Guides: Single wire, Minimas, single foot ceramic, double foot ceramic, roller...use the lightest that will do the job. Single foot means one wrap instead of two = 1/2 the thread and 1/2 the finish.
Guide wraps: Underwrap, over wrap, single wrap, use only what is required for the job at hand.
Wrap finish: 3 coats of PermaGloss is a lot lighter than 1 or 2 layers of epoxy. Fine for many fly, spinning or casting rods. Boat rods probaly do better with a few layers of epoxy...
Tip top: For many TT's, a wrap is not needed. From a performance standpoint, this is the best place to reduce weight. If you feel that the rod looks unfinished, and really lacking without a wrap, add a single trim band, or a very, very small rendering of the previous wraps.
Ferrules: Many maufacturers warranty their blanks, without a ferrule wrap. Build it that way. (I personally think this looks very crude, so I'll add just a small wrap for decoration).
Grips: In addition to what other have mentioned, consider a split grip. You'll reduce cork or eva material, plus the weight of the corresponding epoxy. BUT, a split grip is not desirable if you use rod holders, or may not suit your 2 handed casting style.
ETC.....
Build the lightest rod you can, but never at the expense of intended function and use (abuse) of the rod.

George

I guess I should have added "that was comfortable" to my subject...

Bobby Feazel,

Very true, never really thought about that.

Bill Stevens,

Under 3 ounces!? That is crazy! And I plan on this being a multipurpose bass rod of sorts, casting, around 7'. More performance base on this rod. And fishing for both pleasure and cash whenever possible! Skill level; amazing, duh.

It's interesting to read what everyone has to say. I knew this would be a good topic with some helpful insight. I plan on doing all that I can to make the rod light but not sacrificing the comfort all together. So, yes, I do still want a reel seat. No tape or thread.

And what about number of guides? What is the least amount of micros you can get away with on a rod without it hindering its performance?

Another thing, the foam core composite; is there a way to create sort of a half foam core/half eva or hypalon split griip? Something like the Boyd Duckett Carrot Stick or the new Airrus K-lite?

Any other help here still greatly appreciated. Thanks guys!

I'm using 8lb foam and my cores alone weigh more than cork. I've poured almost 3 dozen. Any ideas?

Chuck

4lb foam.

Anyone have pictures of these: Foam core carbon skinned grips

Thanks!

After you have built your lightest possible rod do not yield to the temptation to screw a couple of ounces of weight into the butt in order to balance your rod.

Ryan you started a good thread! Huge amount on the table at at present.

The balance issue is as complex as the lightest and most durable,

Balance point conversations are never specific enough on Internet Forums:

The main point is that there is no rule for all rods or anglers..

How about this: I had the priviledge of refurbishing a few rods for an Elite.

Flip Stick - Top Elite Angler - Huge Beast of a Rod - Eight Feet - Rear Grip Length 9.0 inches - Tip quite heavy with no balance installed -

I made the mistake in commenting on the length of the rear grip to the original custom builder - and the apparent tip weight - asking him if he wanted me to balance the rods prior to returning!

Boy did I learn a valuable lesson!

The builders comment was "He fishes for a living and the reason is money! Only when fish are safely in the boat can he relax - leave the rod exactly as is".

The reason the rod is built that way is fish control during the period of time that the big ones have a huge chance of escape - close to boat, head shaking and darting this way and that - he puts the tip of the rod on the fishy's nose and does not want the rear grip length hanging up on this rainwear, coats or body. The movements of the rods have to be quick and precise to remain hooked up.

If I told you the rod was also spiral wrapped do you know who I am talking about? I am in no position to tell him how to balance a rod - he simply does not care!

Hope the origial custom builders sees this thread and gives me a grade on my lesson for the day! I ama sure he will also mark up my test paper with other comments as well!

Double post.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 02/11/2010 02:53AM by Mo Yang.

Lightest that you can fish with:

1. Wrap your guides using titanium guides.
2. tape your reel to the bare blank.

The question that I am more interested is lightest reel that is also ergonomic and balanced. At that point, the answer changes.

Mo

Mike;
“It would be nice if we had a similar way to attach baitcasting reels.”
Am working on that one now, thought I would have it ready to bring to the show, but have too many other projects I need to complete first.

Ryan;
"I guess I should have added "that was comfortable" to my subject... "
You’d be surprised how comfortable a spinning rod with the reel attached onto a light carbon fiber handle with thread can be.

Chuck:
“I'm using 8lb foam and my cores alone weigh more than cork. I've poured almost 3 dozen. Any ideas?”
Ya!
Eliminate the core!