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Ice Fishing Rod Advice
Posted by: Preston Quan (---.dsl.bell.ca)
Date: November 03, 2009 06:56PM

Hi,

First post in over 5 years so I had to re-register.

I'd like to build a few ice fishing rods for the winter. I'm planning on using solid graphite blanks by St. Croix, Thorne Bros, or any other suitable generic blank.

Lake Trout (outdoor) rod: 36" Medium-heavy
Fuji NPS reel seat (any other suggestions?)
Questions: approximately how many guides? 4-5 (based on static load test)? What sizes should they be? Fuji Alconites...are they too heavy for the rod? What size top?

Perch (inside) rod: 24" Ultra-light
Fuji NPS reel seat (any other suggestions?)
Questions: approximately how many guides? 4-6 (based on static load test)? What sizes should they be? Fuji Alconites...are they too heavy for the rod? What size top?

I'm in Canada. Any suggestions for suppliers?

Thanks in advance,
Preston
Toronto



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 11/03/2009 06:58PM by Preston Quan.

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Re: Ice Fishing Rod Advice
Posted by: Rolly Beenen (---.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com)
Date: November 03, 2009 10:29PM

Preston
I would use a solid cork tennesse handle with rings as they are warmer. I build them for the Bay of Quinte and Iuse the alconite guides on my rods but I use the unsanded Mudhole blanks and cut them to get the action/power that I want. I am in bowmanville

Rolly Beenen
Rovic Custom Rods

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Re: Ice Fishing Rod Advice
Posted by: les cline (---.dsl.kscymo.swbell.net)
Date: November 03, 2009 10:55PM

I like the NPS seats. They are light and non-metal (except for the hoods). It is a simple matter of putting a piece of tape over the metal parts if that sort of thing makes a difference to you. (The Tennessee handles are fine for 'warmth' but I think it is overrated. Unless I am using an all metal seat I do not notice that much of a difference. When it is cold it is just cold.)

For a spinning rod I'd go with a 20 mm Alconite butt guide...to a 12 or 10 mm....to 6 or 5 mm for the rest. Five to six guides total. Without the need for casting line flow I'd place them in a good static progression and call it good. Go with guides as small as you can! I know icing can be a problem, but it all honesty, I've fished with plenty of ice on the guides with 4 mm guides and did not notice so much of a difference.

Me, I like a baitcasting reel to keep the line low on a short blank. In this set up I can use a 7 to 6mm singlefoot guide and the rest 6 or 5mm...or ALL the same small size. And have you thought of a spiral wrap?

I love to lake trout fish (Manitoba) but it's in the summer with heavy jigs. Different rod set-up for that.....but I have had no troubles with the micro guides (as long as they will pass all knots).

Les

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Re: Ice Fishing Rod Advice
Posted by: roger wilson (---.hsd1.mn.comcast.net)
Date: November 04, 2009 11:11AM

Preston,
If you have more specific questions, you can send me a separate e-mail to

hflier@comcast.net

I have built many ice rods over the last couple of years and have a couple of thoughts based on my customers as well as my own needs and wishes.

1. I build only solid blank ice rods. Either fiberglass or graphite.
I have had virtually every hollow ice rod - either fiberglass or graphite - break under the use and stress of ice fishing. The break either as a result of travel hardships or actual breakage on a hook set while catching a fish. The issue I think has to do with the hard life of an ice rod, tough travel conditions, cold, and most importantly - short length. The extreme stress of the short rods on a heavy fish don't play together.

2. I only use solid EVA, or Cork handles, with NO reel seat. IN the first place there is no need for a reel seat, and no matter the material, the reel seat and uncovered reel foot is going to be colder than an eva or cork grip with a taped on reel. I built a couple of ice rods with a reel seat many years ago, and have never built another one. Bottom line - any plastic, aluminum, or other metal is going to be colder to pick up and use than cork, eva, or tape that is used to cover the reel foot when it is taped on the grip.

3. Last year, I migrated over to the Pac Bay Minima guides for ice fishing and will continue to use them. They give a larger sized guide opening for the guide number and are in fact lighter than most of the comparable guides. I have also built many rods using fly guides for the running guides and tip. The tip in particular works very well by the use of a fly guide tip. It is very easy to get correct sized tips to fit the smaller diameter of the fine tipped solid graphite or glass rods. With the minimal use that guides get, there is no issue with guide wear by the use of a non insert guide as is the case by the use of a fly guide. I did learn that the short feet of these guides really do benefit by the use of the locking wrap when being wrapped.

I have used the Fuji Alconite guides on a lot of past ice rods and they work very well.

4. Minimize the use of the numbers of guides. On some of the shorter rods, like a 15 inch rod, 2 guides are sufficient. Most of the 25-35 inch rods use 3-4 guides, depending on the action.
To avoid the use of "line jump effect" i.e. having the line jerking during retrieve from guide drag - I will use a higher frame guide for the stripper guide, if this is a spinning reel. Not so important if it is a casting rod.
The high frame guide is only important for the first or stripper guide to keep the line from jumping as the line is retrieved.
Also, try to put the first or stripper guide as far down the rod toward the tip as is practical. The further down the rod the stripper guide is placed, the lower in height the first guide can be and avoid the line jumping syndrome. This is also one of the reasons that fewer guides can be placed on an ice fishing rod.

Lets say that you are building a 30 inch rod. Lets also say that your total handle, reel seat length is 8 inches. this gives you a balance of 22 inches.
On a normal long rod, one might put the first stripper guide at a distance of 18-24 inches from the reel. Obviously, with a total remaining length of 22 inches, you aren't going to do that.
But if you cut the distance in 1/2 and put the first stripper guide at 11 inches - you now only have 11 inches of rod left on which to place guides. Thus the need for a fewer number of guides.

Some folks who have not built a lot of ice rods before make the mistake of placing the first stripper guide at a distance of 3-6 inches from the reel, so that it looks "right". This very short distance makes for a very difficult rod to use without getting the infamous line jerk syndrome as a result of the line jumping off the reel during the retreive.

5. For most of the rods which will be used outside, I will never go with a guide or tip size smaller than a size 8. Any smaller than that and you get into very difficult icing conditions on the line, guides and tips.
One thing that many fishermen will do if fishing outside, is that they will knock the rod on the side of the hole, or tent pole to snap off the ice on a guide or tip. This is also one of the reasons why hollow ice rods are short lived. The constant banging of the rod blank on a pole or ice can easily damage the thin walls of a small hollow blank.

If I know that the rod will only be used indoors, I will then go down to smaller guides and tips - on down to size 6 or 4 with no issues. However, I do like to start with at least a size 10 or 12 guide for the first stripper guide, just to help with the line retrieval issues. There is really no reason to go with a stripper guide any larger than about a size 12, maybe a size 16. Remember, you are not casting the line, you are only letting it drop down a hole and if there is any ice present, you are likely pulling it off the reel.

6. I also will not use any of the braided or super lines on ice rods that are going to be used outside. Simply too much problems with the line soaking up water and freezing solid. Then, you are left with an ice ball on your reel, and can not get the line off the spool. If you are fishing in a heated shelter, then it is a non issue. I will always have at least one or two braided lines on rods that I am using for heavy jigging to minimize line stretch and maximize feel.
But, if I am going to be fishing outside in subfreezing weather, I will always use a supple mono line, even though there are stretch issues to deal with. Better to have some stretch, than not being able to get the line off the spool.

Good luck
Roger

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Re: Ice Fishing Rod Advice
Posted by: Dave Orr (---.nt.internorth.net)
Date: November 04, 2009 04:49PM

Preston
Here's a couple I built last year.
The lighter rod has a #8 tip and the heavy rod has a #10.
I also agree with using solid banks for durability. These two rods are bomb proof.
I use a lot of braid on my setups due to fishing deep water almost exclusively.
While I have had the line stick to the ice a few times I haven't experienced the icing on the reel that Roger has.
It probably has to do with the very cold temps where I live freezing the water before it has a chance to get on the reel.
Average temps during the winter in my area are -25 to -35 C
The flocked grips are very comfortable in the winter plus they give me a chance to use up my low grade cork. ;)

[www.rodbuilding.org]

[www.rodbuilding.org]

Regards
Dave

Fishing is Life the rest is just Details

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Re: Ice Fishing Rod Advice
Posted by: Chad Huderle (---.client.mchsi.com)
Date: November 04, 2009 09:32PM

Preston, I agree with all of the points Roger stated. But as an alternative to number 2, some ice fisherman don't like messing with taping the reel and prefer a workable reelseat. I solved this by using a Batson pipe style reel seat, which I modified to reduce overall weight, and then flocked it. The flocking addresses the issue with a bare hand touching cold plastic.

[www.rodbuilding.org]

Thanks,
Chad Huderle

Huderle Custom Rods
Prior Lake, MN

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Re: Ice Fishing Rod Advice
Posted by: Preston Quan (---.nssi.telus.com)
Date: November 05, 2009 12:27PM

Guys,

Thanks for all the advice!

Chad, what exactly is flocking?

Preston

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Re: Ice Fishing Rod Advice
Posted by: Mike Barkley (---.nap.wideopenwest.com)
Date: November 05, 2009 01:20PM

Roger,

Great little article. Definatel worth filing. Thanks

Mike (Southgate, MI)
If I don't want to, I don't have to and nobody can make me (except my wife) cuz I'm RETIRED!!

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Re: Ice Fishing Rod Advice
Posted by: Heath Boeddeker (---.runestone.stellarllc.net)
Date: November 05, 2009 01:58PM

Howdy Roger ,

I concur with Mike . I gained alot of knowledge from your response as I fish in Minnesota during the winter I will use of the knowledge gained from you to build a couple of Ice Rods before freeze up down here .

Again Thank you ,
Heath

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Re: Ice Fishing Rod Advice
Posted by: Chad Huderle (---.client.mchsi.com)
Date: November 05, 2009 07:04PM

Here's a quote from Tom Kirkman that I just noticed on the flocking manufacturers website, [www.donjer.com].

"Flocking can be used to create a soft, velvety surface on a hard item, or to create a more durable and non-slip surface on a smooth or otherwise non-durable surface."
~ Tom Kirkman
RodMaker Magazine Aug '04

Tom published a very detailed description of the process in Rodmaker. Check the Rodmaker magazine website for which back issue.

Thanks,
Chad Huderle

Huderle Custom Rods
Prior Lake, MN

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