First of all I want to say welcome to everyone here. There is alot of great information available on this board and it has helped me great deal since I've gotten back into rod building the last couple months. Now onto my problem.

I read all about the new Threadmaster finishes and decided to give them a try, both the regular and the lite. I was familiar working with Flex Coat so I mixed and applied them in the same manner. They both worked good except I couldn't get rid of the buubles. Initially I mixed the finish by hand, being careful not to induce to many bubbles and then poured it onto a sheet of foil to allow any bubble to escape before I applied the finish. I have tried using brushes, spatula, and even knitting needles to apply the finish. No bubbles were visible in the finish when I applied it to the wraps but maybe an hour into the curing process I would find them, too late to do anything about.

I've treid just about everything I can think of to get rid of these bubbles. I warm the bottles in hot tap water before I measure and mix. I've been using an epoxy mixer to mix the finish. It always appears to bubble free on the foil after mixing. I even tried applying some heat to the wraps after they coated. Still, I'm getting bubble that are escaping late in the setting up process.

Am I missing something with these new finishes? I never had these kinds of problems with the Flex Coat.

The bubbles may be coming from the thread or your brush. Do you use color preserver or are you applying the epoxy directly to the bare thread?

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It's the second coat that I'm having the problems on. The first coat I'm only applying enough epoxy to saturate the threads and fill tunnels. No bubble issues there at all. The problems this time are over the inscription. Last night I turned the rod by hand for about an hour and then put it in the drying box and started turning it. This morning there were four bubbles the had popped leaving small crater like dimples in the finish. I used a spatula to apply the finish.

Over an inscription the bubbles would almost have to have been in the finish itself. Nowhere else for them to have come from if the edges of the labels are well adhered and sealed.

Before I assume too much, let me ask you if you were using the Lite or Regular build version of TM.

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The lite version. And there is no label. I used a paint pen. This is the second coat over the inscription. The frist coat did not have any bubbles at all and was applied in the same manner.

I also have another question: is it possible to apply the epoxy too sparingly, prohibiting it from leveling?

And thanks for the replys.

Okay, one of the problems that can occur with the Lite versions of any finish is the longer pot or working life. This means that bubbles have a much longer time to rear their ugly heads. With most higher build formula epoxies, at an hour and a half what you see is what you'll get. Not so with some of the lite formulas. You may have to watch the finish for up to 3 to 4 hours before you can safely assume that there will be no further surprises.

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Thanks for the help. One last thing. The only wraps that I'm having bubble issues with are the inscriptionarea and the larger guides on fly rods, the stripper and the one right above it. Is it possible that I'm still applying too much epoxy. Again, I'm turning by hand for awhile before puting it on the dryer. I'm waiting a couple minutes between hand turns and I'm not getting any sagging.

The Lite versions can't really be put on very heavy without getting runs and sags, even with rotation. So if you're not having any problem there, your application amount is probably okay.

There isn't anything in an ink inscription that would generate bubbles so these have to originate from your finish. Keep in mind that epoxy does not need heat in order to level - leveling is automatic. Heat generally expands any bubbles that are present so they will rise and leave the surface. If you don't see any bubbles in your finish, the application of heat could be doing more harm than good. Although, I don't really see that as your problem here. I think you're just going to have to watch your finish until you're sure it has set and no further changes can occur.

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I also have a bubble or two "rear its ugly head" occasionally. Is there a way to "fix" this short of waiting and recoating after 1st application cures? Nothing I have tried works. Picking, poking, heat, etc. I know what an ounce of prevention is worth but to have one bubble ruin a 3 or 4" long stretch of finish over a decal is very frustrating and time consuming to correct by refinishing.

If it happens and you catch it before its too late, you can pick it open and then use a small drop of finish on a toothpick to fill in the crater. Watch it for a few seconds and it if does not appear to be flowing and smoothing, use a gentle flame to very lightly warm that area for just a 2 or 3 seconds. That's generally all it takes to momentarily thin the epoxy and allow it to reflow and smooth over.

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Bob,
With all of the finish work that I do, I simply mix, apply, slow it down, heat a bit to thin the mix and insure that every area is free of any bubbles and or runs or sags.
I will go back and double check after about 5 minutes and do a touch up if needed. I generally put the finish on fairly heavy, so that as I slightly heat the finish and it thins; the finish flows well and fills all voids and levels well. Any extra drips off, or is picked off with a brush.

If I don't use a bit of gentle heat - I will always end up with a bubble or two. So, I just make a point of doing it.

It is simple and it works.

Every system has its good and bad points so find a system that works well for you and stick with it.

Roger

Roger,

From what you desrcibe, I am doing pretty much the same as you. I rexamined me process over the weekend and I think I have found what the problem may be. I built a dryer box over the winter and put some halogen bulbs in there to heat since the rod building room is a little chilly in the winter. With the bulbs, the box heats up to about 80-85 degrees. I didn't notice until this weekend but with the lamps on the inside of box got up to almost 100 degrees. I think the increas in the temp was accelerating the cure and not the letting the bubbles escape in a timely manner.

Anyway, I sanded and recoated the inscription area and let the finish cure in the box at about 80 degrees and there were no bubbles. Finally!

You may not even need the heat if you are letting it turn all night. It will probably level better and have more time to release those bubbles.

Bill - willierods.com