customer handed me a team diawa zillion rod TBZL661 MXB with two guides missing look to be about a 5. they appear to have just came out from under the wrap.
I don't have the right guides yet but something close and they will slide back into the slot, when i get the right guides, (suggestions on what guides they may be are welcome) what are your thoughts on putting some finish into the hole, rough the guide foot up a little slide it back into the hole and seal the back side. I don't see any reason this will not work,

its a very nice rod appearance wise but the quality is lacking, two other guides are off center as if they have slipped. in the long run it may be better to redo all of them. but he seems reluctant to let me do that. Naturally i will make it plain that anything other than a complete rewrap of all guides may end up not working for long.
I am not sure i can duplicate the wrap 100% and this would keep the look the same.

One thing for sure, just because they look good don't mean the quality is good, i have never seen a reel seat like that either, the sides of the seat flair out from the rod, leaving about a 1/4" space between the blank and seat, on both sides and the nut is also part of the fore grip, eva material or something along that line.

his wife says he has a lip ripping type of hook set



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 07/10/2009 07:04AM by Jim Creed.

Just putting a new guide back into the hole is not going to work, the epoxy is not what holds the guides onto the rod, it is the thread. You should at least rewrap the 2 guides that came out and use a Forhan locking wrap to help hold the guide in. If the other guides have actually slipped to make the out of alignment, it would be best to rewrap them as well because they are sure to come out at some time soon.

I'm with Mike on this one, I would just re-wrap all of the guides.

Jim,
If the rod that you are working on is this one:
[www.fishfreakonline.com]

it appears that the guides are the Fuji concept sic guides.
I also believe that the reel seat is a Daiwa molded seat.

The other folks are right - the guide won't hold if you simply try to reinsert it under the wrap.

Cut off the original wrap and retie using the forham lock on it as well.
These thread colors - if the rod you have is the same as in the picture - are pretty standard and should be easy to match.

If the customer doesn't want you to touch the other guides, then leave them alone - even if the alignment is not perfect. He apparently is satisfied with the rods performance, even if all of the guides do not line up.

Take care
Roger

Jim, rewrap the 2 missing guides. As long as you're into the thread colors and wrap finish, throw the guy a freebie and rewrap the guides that are possibly loose or maybe out of alignment, and you'll have a loyal customer.
Tom White

Tom White
Rod & Reel Restoration

I went to the Diawa site and they say the guides are Fuji SIC concept guides. I agree with Tom, for what it would cost for you to do the other 2 guides, I would rewrap them as well and make them straight.

Cut the wraps off and start over.

Definately re-wrap the repalcement guides! Never cut corners on a paying customer or it will come back & bite you on the butt for sure.

Those look like simple black wraps with silver metallic bands. Pretty simple to duplicate.

If, after bringing to his attention that the other guides need attention, he expressly says NO to fixing them I would leave them alone. However, if I was not told to leave them alone I would fix them and call it a freeby.

All that said, if I owned the rod I would be tempted to use a little quick-set Rod Bond and glue the 2 guides back in place and put another light coat of finish to seal the deal just to see how such an "on the water" type of fix would really hold up. Never on a customer's rod though even if the "cheapest fix" was requested.

Raymond Adams
Eventually, all things merge, and a river runs through it..



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 07/10/2009 10:39AM by Raymond Adams.

Tell the customer that he has two options! You can reinsert and glue the guides back into place but you offer no guarantee that it they will not come out again and maybe very quickly! Or you can rewrap the guides in place with a Forhan lock wrap and offer him an assurance that they will not come back out for a long, long while. Put the ball in his court and then do as he wishes.

Do it right and re-wrap. If the others come out later he will be back and maybe have you do them all.

Bill - willierods.com

Barry Kneller Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Tell the customer that he has two options! You can
> reinsert and glue the guides back into place but
> you offer no guarantee that it they will not come
> out again and maybe very quickly! Or you can
> rewrap the guides in place with a Forhan lock wrap
> and offer him an assurance that they will not come
> back out for a long, long while. Put the ball in
> his court and then do as he wishes.

I couldn't disagree more with Barry. Some say the customer is always right but I wouldn't allow one to tell me to do a substandard job for any reason. Yes, there are 2 options. Allow me to complete the repair as it should be done or go see another repair person.

Raymond Adams
Eventually, all things merge, and a river runs through it..

I would never do a repair job knowing it may come back since the other guides obviously need worked on. If I can`t do it right I wouldn`t want any one to know that I did any of it. Tell him you will duplicate the current wraps to the best of your ability, all or none. It is going to have your name on it.

Take pics of the old wraps if you do the job.

Bill

Ohio Rod Builders

Canton, Ohio

thanks for the input, based on the fact another guide is misaligned i would think redoing the entire rod would be best. and i knew that sliding new guides into the finish was the short cut way, i just wanted confirmation.
I just sold this gentlemen a rod for shakey head fishing and he is very happy, i would be cutting my own throat to short cut him now.
I will let you know how it turns out. i will take pics of the before and after.
thanks again

Oh, Roger your right that is the rod, and if he paid $199.95 for something the quides fall out of I need to make it right, so he will know the difference, the shakey head rod I just sold him i would be highly surprised if the guides fall out of it. he may break them but they won't fall out.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 07/10/2009 02:34PM by Jim Creed.

If I was doing the repair, the job would be done correctly for all loose guides. Even if I can only feel good about charging for the 2 missing guides. A little thread and finish, small amount of labor for free goes a long ways. Bad mouth words are never a good thing. Just my $.02 worth.

Mark

mark, i agree, i am self employed, have been for over 20 years, most of my business is referal, angry customers is not what you want.
I do the rods more as a hobby, only had one what you would call a professional sale, so the cost is not the issue,
I am going to do the two missing and the one that is misaligned, if the thread work works out, i will more than likely do all but the double foot guides.

Mark Mulanax Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> If I was doing the repair, the job would be done
> correctly for all loose guides. Even if I can only
> feel good about charging for the 2 missing
> guides. A little thread and finish, small amount
> of labor for free goes a long ways. Bad mouth
> words are never a good thing. Just my $.02
> worth.
>
> Mark


I totally agree Mark,
Especially if a guy just bought a new custom from me! I see the conversation going something like this.

Hey, can you replace the 2 missing guides on this rod for me? Sure! Let me see what ya got there. Are you aware that some othe other guides need attention too? See how they are knocked over and getting loose? Yea, but that's OK I don't want to spend a bunch on it right now and it works fine. OK, I'll tell you what. As your already a valued customer, I'll only charge you for the 2 guides and the rest is on me. That way I won't have to work on it again later and you'll have something you can depend on once again. Hey! Thank YOU! When can I pick it up?

Raymond Adams
Eventually, all things merge, and a river runs through it..

raymond i am not sure if he even noticed the out of line guide or forgot to mention it. his wife brought it to me. i know he wants it right and remember something being said about several more needing work. i am new at this as far as doing other people's work but will give him the best i got. For me he is the gateway into his friends that fish the flw tour. It would not hurt my feelings a bit if some of them ask for a rod built by me. but as i have said before its a hobby, i am well aware my chances of making a living at this are slim and none,
the helpful adivce and knowledge gained on here is the only reason i have gotten as far as i have.

I'm sure you will do right by your valued customer Paul and I appologize If I sounded like I was assuming otherwise or if my example above sounded like I was assuming your meeting went or should have went like that.

Rod building is still a hobby for me as well but I have many years of customer service under my belt. Just offering my opinion.

You get a pro-tour client who wins and boasts about your rods, skys the limit my friend and in a real hurry. It's a two edge sword though so be careful.

Raymond Adams
Eventually, all things merge, and a river runs through it..

Since he did not tell you - not to - fix them all and the word will get around.

Bill - willierods.com