Ive been building rods for about 4 years (all light to heacy saltwater) and still the part I hate the most is gluing the grips, hancle, reel seat ect...

I use the flexcoast slow dry epoxy. For a small amount of glue in mix in the small measuring cups. Stir for about 3 minutes. If I need alot of glue I take either the resin and dump it into the harder and mix. I only do this when they are both half full. Is this a bad idea? I find many times the gule will harden extremely fast and become very got.

The first thing I'd do is to switch to a gel type epoxy like Quick Bond or Ultimate Gel. They're easier to work with.

Nothing wrong with the Flex Coat glue, however, you may be over mixing it and thus creating more exothermic heat in the process, which then speeds up the set time even more. The adhesives are not quite as critical as the finishes - you needn't mix it for 3 minutes, More like 30 to 45 seconds. You're not worried about bubbles so you can stir it briskly for that time and be ready to go.

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Glueing should not be the thing you find most difficult when building a rod unless you are not following directions or using too much epoxy and not working fast enough so that the glues hardens and heats up. Believe it or not I use 7 different glues when I build a rod and each glue has a special quality for a specific purpose. I know that some people will say that is crazy but I have been doing if that way for so many years now that I couldn't think of doing it any other way. Just remember to use your glue in a well ventilated place.

For two part epoxys I suggest you mix it on a flat surface . This will prevent the heating and hardening. For other glues (contact rubber cement ) you can use a mixing cup without a problem

Sounds like using a bottle of plastic container causes too much heat and that I am mixing it too much. Is qucik bond and ultimate gel as good as 2 part epoxy?

They are 2-part epoxies, but have a thicker consistency so they stay where you put them - they don't tend to seep out of joints. Mix them on a piece of cardboard or ceramic tile by folding and blending the 2 parts (you can just eyeball them - there is some margin for error).

When you confine your epoxy mix in a small area such as a plastic cup, where heat cannot readily escape, and then really work it for several minutes, you are pretty sure to get a very, very quick set.


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If you've never tried quick bond or rod bond... you really should. Great stuff, very easy to work with, strong as anything - maybe even stronger.

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AD

I agree with Alex. Rod Bond has no equals. Once on it does not creep. When I put it on the rod and inside the grip, I then spray a little denatured alcohol on the rod area over the rod bond to act as a slippery lubricant. It will evaporate shortly after. Try it, and you will not go back.
Sanford Hochman

One more thing I forgot to mention: you have all day to play with the rod bond. It has enough working time for hours that you can adust anything a long while after it is used. I usually come back to my rod a few hours later and make any final adjustments needed for the grip or reel seat.

I've tried the Flex Coat grip epoxy but I'll swear by Rod Bond. It has plenty of workable time, isn't near as messy and holds just as good.

I Am also a fan of Rod Bond, 10 min. or regular. I am just guessing but it sounds like you are getting to much resin than harder in your flex coat mix. Also fold the mixes togather do not whip

Good Wraps Bob

Sanford,

Why do you spray the rod bond with alcohol? Personally, I've found the rod bond itself to provide plenty of lubricant for sliding things into place.

Joe

Bob Balcombe-you are correct. You can even taylor the cure rate with different reduced amounts of hardner. I don't know how little hardner you can use and have it still set properly but I know you can use too much. I don't understand the chemistry behind that, but I accept it.

i love rod bond!

it stays where you want it to and no worries about it seeping or dripping

-
Give a man a fish, he'll eat for a day..
Teach a man to fish, he'll be broke!

Al,
A couple of thoughts:
1. No need to mix for 3 minutes as Tom pointed out.
Simply use a flat spatula or stick to completely mix the resin and hardner, until you have a uniform color through the mix. This is typically somewhere between 10 seconds to a minute depending on glue type as well as quantity bening mixed.

2. With respect to quick cure.
Use a flat plate to spread the mix to minimize self heating as is the case when mixing in a small tall container.

3. Use slower drying epoxy. If using only a very small portion, or butt cap, etc. I will use 5 minute epoxy. Otherwise, I use only 30 minute industrial epoxy. This generally means that I have about 7-10 minutes of nice setup time before the epoxy kicks and begans to cure.

4. Perhaps as important as anything else, is that whenever I put together a handle, reel seat and fore grip - I prefit everything, including arbors, and any build up required of the blank before the final glue up. If using individual cork rings, I insure that each ring is of the correct size and is in the correct location with respect to its final glue up.
I have made many different motor / chuck setups for rod building. The setup that I use for my gluing is one that I made of a 24 volt 2-speed cordless drill that I stripped down and set up on a permenant stand. I use a 0-24 volt variable dc power supply that is set by a fixed foot pedal. i.e. I can set the speed, and take my foot off the pedal and the motor will maintain its speed. This works very well for gluing. I tend to use a speed of about 20-30 rpm during glue application. Once I get the glue laid around the blank, I will slip the appropriate pieces in place, then move on to the next part of the handle.
I use large syringes to get an exact A:B mix of resin and hardner. Then, about 30 seconds of mixing, then about 1-2 minutes to apply all of the glue, squish everthing together and apply the handle clamps. Finally, another 30 seconds or minute to clean up everthing and I am good to go.

Again, after pushing everthing together, I will use the drill motor to quicly spin the blank, using a stiff brush dipped in Alchol to clean up any residue around the handle or threads of the reel seat. I also make a point to apply a nice layer of oil on the reel seat threads and metal parts of the reel seat to insure that any possible slight epoxy left will not cause any issues with the reel seat. It seems that no matter how careful one is - there is a tiny, tiny chance that a bit of epoxy might have been left in a thread and or crack of the reel seat which causes a long term issue with the reel seat. By applying a layer of oil on the threads of the reel seat before going away from the reel seat for setup, the oil will keep this tiny quantity of potential left over epoxy from jamming the threads. i.e. the epoxy won't stick and it will easily wipe off when cured.

When doing these glue ups using the variable speed drill motor - I am always using the lay up - with no butt cap in place. therefore, the butt of the blank is always open. So, I have a piece of solid stock that is a tight fit into the butt of the blank to allow a nice positive rotation of the blank.

Take care
Roger

p.s.
A few years ago, I was watching the discovery channel and there was a session on building fly rods. There was a video taken from inside the Sage fly rod factory.
The interesting thing that I noticed was the way that the glued up their handles. Since their assembly area had a very tall ceiling, they assembled their rods with the rods in a vertical position.
They did as I do, i.e. they had the butt of the rod placed on a rotating manderal to spin the handle during assembly. Then, they simply had all of the rod components threaded on the blank before starting. They mixed up their epoxy, and started the blank spinning.
They applied glue, then dropped the next ring down the blank to the bottom, and continued with all of the components until the handle was complete. They were quite sparing on their use of epoxy, so that there was typically little to no epoxy on the outside of the rings to have to clean up. Then, the pulled it off the manderal, dropped it on a clamp manderal and dropped a clamp arm down on the top handle component. I timed a couple of blank glue ups in the production environment and I think that the typical handle glue up was about 30 seconds - from start to finish.

Take care
Roger

Joe,
Sometimes the grip (EVA) is such a tight fit, I have to really use a lot of pressure to squeeze it down on the blank, and the alcohol helps to make it much easier. You only get one chance to push it down. If it locks up on you before it reaches the largest end of the butt, you may not be able to get it down any further. But when sprayed with alcohol on top of the rod bond, it slides easily. To each his own, I guess. You're right, the rod bond is generally used as is, such as the reel seat, tip, etc.
Sanford

Sanford,

Thanks, I got it now.

Joe