Hello all. Newbie builder here. Lots of good info on this forum. it's awesome!
My question is: How do I keep my thread from backing back down the guide foot while power wrapping? I have re-done each wrap several times with no success. I have tried different tensions,. This is what I got going on:
I have two under wraps. I preped my guide foot well. The first time I wrapped it clumoed up at the start of the foot. Next made it up the foot, but left slight gaps that would allow me to see the underwrap slightly. If I burnish the thread the metallic wears off. Every other time the thread starts to climb then backs off. or breaks. ( happens about 20 time each foot) So I thought re-do everything. Polished the feet as to not break the thread and make it eaiser to climb. Also put more CP on. I am ussing A metallic thread. Would thicker thread work better? None of this seems to help. As soon as I wrap the threads either leaves gaps or backsdown on themselves going up the foot. About ready to throw it out the window. Please help.

Believe it or not, but this is something that is just going to take some time. Power wrapping requires practice and it will take many dozens and dozens of guides until you become proficient. There is a speed and thread angle that will work (provided you have indeed done a good job prepping the guide foot to the proper taper) and you'll find it after a hundred or so guide wraps under power.

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Have you filed down the guide feet? I find that if the thread won't climb up the guide it is because the guide foot is not tapered properly. A nice taper will provide a "slope" for the thread to climb, as opposed to the thread trying to jump up from the blank and onto the guide. When I file my guides I taper the foot and then file each side of the taper, kind of like a double edged knife.
I hope this makes sense and helps solve your wrapping problem!


Matt

Brad,
I'm not much for power wrappers myself, especially for guides. If you are just starting with a power wrapper that might be causing some of your trouble. If you have not done any wrapping by hand then I would recommend trying that to better learn the correct tension and thread angles that Tom mentioned. Take into consideration that many experienced hand wrappers have trouble switching to a power wrapper. Good Luck!

Steve

Brad,
You might try using non metallic thread to get comfortable with the power wrapper. It is much easier to use and much more forgiving. After your comfortable, you can try the metallics again.

Good luck,
Robert

It really sounds like you need to take another try at prepping the feet. The angle needs to be pretty shallow. If you have prepped for a thin foot and a good start, but left too much of an angle on the foot, then the thread will slump as you climb up. I suspect you have more trouble with the larger guides than the smaller ones.

If the thread doesn't climb right over the edge of the foot and keep going as you wrap, then the foot needs more prep. Also check your tension and try some different settings to see what works best for you. As Tom said, it just takes some practice.

It's my least favorite thing but I do much better with the small bench grinder I got from harbor freight. $40 for a 3 1/2" grinder and it sits on the end of my wrapping bench.

Keep us posted.

Terry

I will definately use all of your considerations. All are great and appreciated.
I too have a bench grinder. I am just afraid of taking too much material off the foot. (after 2 attempts it's getting a little thin). Maybe tomorrow I will take pics for you of the feet. I have not even made it to any of the small guides yet. Are the bigger guides typically the hardest to wrap? Because of the steeper slope? I had no problems with the underwraps.

I think you need to change your thread angle. move the thread away from the tip of the guide foot, and as soon as you get a couple of wraps to climb on, stop and pack the threads and then straighten out your thread a bit. What size thread are you using?

Steve Bro
(BroCo Custom Rods)

Picture of well preped guide foot: [www.rodbuilding.org]

Bill - willierods.com

Stve outlined the way I do it. Prep the foot and get a couple of wraps on it and pack them tight. Do a few more and pack them again. It gets to be slow going but I've never been in a hurry when buidling a rod.

The larger guides are indeed more difficult to wrap due to the thicker foot.

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I am using size A threads. I have gone through about a half spool only on the first guide. Another problem is after I start to climb the foot, I pack the threads back down the foot, but the threads underneath the guide stay further up. make sense? Throws off the whole line of thread. Should I be using a larger size thread? How many coats of CP should I use on under wraps? Does CP have any impact on this problem of my thread not climbing right?

A couple of things for running a power wrapper at warp speed - are you applying a coat of finish to the underwraps? If not the thread sizes for the underwrap and the guide wrap need to be approximately the same diameter or the upper thread needs to be larger. If you are only having problems only with metallics it probably is due to the smaller diameter metallic thread "jumping across the hills and valleys" of the larger thread you are using for the underwrap. I always try to move up in thread size from the bottom to the top of the wrap to keep this from happening. D nylon black is beautiful and is even better when on top - also back off a slight amount on the tension for the upper wraps.

When you pack the thread, push it tighter on the bottom so that the edge is even all the way around.

CP has no effect on your wrapping - it still comes down to practice. You cannot obtain this skill overnight.

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Tom is right.

Get a wooden dowel, a guide and some thread and practice. practice, practice. JMHO C2

my two under wraps are size A thread. And the over wrap is size A also. My bottom wrap is size A metallic silver, the next under wrap is size A metallic blue, and the over wrap is size A metallic black. The stripper guide is a 30 BLNG Fugi. The two bottom wraps appear good. Put 3 coats of CP and dried overnight. Next, I filed down the guide feet and tried to install with the metallic black thread. My wraps either leave gaps, back down over themselves, or clump up. If I try to burnish, it takes the color off. With the CP on, the threads don't wanna move. I have tried adjusting the tension and playing with different angles. I've even tried different speeds and even hand wrapping slow. I think all of you have very good inputs. Think it boils down to practice and maybe try larger thread for the bigger rods.

Brad---------Apply a light coat of finish to your underwraps and put on your dryer------let cure 24 hrs and then do your guides-------that is the way I do it and I have nooooooo problems

I found when I started that using D thread was way easier, I still prefer to use D thread for my main wraps and A thread for trim bands and inlay's. That is just my prefference. Get your self a burnishing tool, that was one of the coolest things that I ever bought when I was starting out. Good luck and don't let it get you down, sometimes it helps just to walk away from it for a few hours.

Steve

Steve Bro
(BroCo Custom Rods)

You can pack over the guide foot because it's steel and the thread will slid. It won't slid on your under wrap so the two sides don't pack evenly. A well cured coat of finish on the under wraps would help this issue.

So i should try to put a light coat of finish over my under wraps then let sit 24hrs? Should I thin the finish at all? What happens if this still does not work? Can I cut it all off and re-do? Sorry so many questions. Seems like I do have hills and valley's that my thread is jumping around with. Just want to make sure that it is still easy to correct if it gets messed up or if it is permenant. Might try the D thread also. Thanks for all the help so far. It is greatly appreciated.

Brad