I built a bait casting setup with medium action on a 7 foot blank.

I wrapped the rod using two guides (10's) to make the transition then an 8 and the rest 6''s and I used a #6 tiptop.

The rod is wrapped to use as a pitching pole for brushhogs and similar baits.

I could get no distance with it.so I took the tiptop off and put a # 7tip...now its okay.

My question is: What guides are you folks using on similar rods? I'm fixing to wrap another rod and I am searching for suggestions.

Roy

Roy,
On rods that will be used for pitching and flipping, I don't spiral as they don't seem to work well when you pitch, especially longer pitches. I've built them all on top with everything from traditional sized guides to micro guides with micro tips and they all work well.

Robert

Roy,

1. What type of line are you using?
2. What diameter is the line?
3. How much weight are you using?

At times, if you are using a "heavy" mono without enough bend the line as it passes through the top on a spiral wrapped rod, the line will push up and rub the blank, and not allow line to flow freely. "Heavy" on one of my spiral wrapped rods with a 4mm Batson tip top is 0.014" mono when using a 1/8 oz. jig or similar sized T-rig.

The solutions are:
1. Use a more limp line, smaller diameter mono or switch to braid.
2. Use a heavier weight.
3. Use a larger tip top.
4. Put the guides on top, so the line pushes away from the blank rather than into it.

It really depends on what you are trying to accomplish, as to where the limits will fall.

Joe

I just got from the Expo ........ Bill Stevens from Swampland Rods had some rods made up with micro's and a reel and I was amazed at the casting distance. The rod I test cast was a 7 ft with all 3.5 micro giudes on top and it cast very far on freespool and no thumbing with no backlash ........... he also got great distance pitching ......... definitely made me a believer .

The only thing I wasn't sure of was the line hit the blank when under stress as when fighting a big fish but another spiral wrapped rod he had seemed to take care of that .......

Roy;
Your challenge may be more of how you spiral wrapped it and your spacing

Also would be good to know what size line you are working with

For many at the show they had the opportunity to pitch or watch pitched a 7'2" rod that was on display at the Batson's both

The rod pitches in the 70- to 90 ft rang comfortable with 50 lb braid.
Guide set up starts with a dbl stripper then all single foots.
8mm--5mm--4.5mm then all 3mm's to tip with a 6mm tip
The rod is spiral wrapped and casts like a dream

Side note; every pitching or flipping stick I've built in the last twenty years (regardless of length and action) has been spiral wrapped and I don't remember any of them not performing as expected.

My concern also would be with your spiral method. What method did you use?

Personally, I would build it with what I call a modified Forhan revolver spiral. I use four guides for the transition. A size 6dbl foot directly on top of the blank, then I use a size 5 sgl foot, size 4 sgl at about 45 and 130 (these are wild guesses for the angle, you have to test to place them properly) then a size 3sgl directly centered on the bottom of the blank. These guides generally have 5-6 inch spacing between them. The difference here from Rich's revolver method is the guide size and offset of the 1st and 4th guide. If you are going to use the size guides Rich recommends I would follow his directions to the T, it works perfectly, through my testing I have not found it necessary to offset the 1st and 4th guide when using the smaller guide sizes, they are small enough that the line centers on the blank on its own.

Once the transition is complete I uze size 3 sgl foot guides out to the tip. For my flip/pitch rods using over 17 pound Mono/Copolymer/Flouro I use a size 6 Alconite top, or flanged batson top. I ran into an issue last season where I would get an occasional hang in my pitch when I was using a size 3 guide. It took a while but I narrowed the problem down to the stiffness of the line cauing it to rub the blank, and pinch in the size 3 ring when making the sharp angle and the beginning of a pitch or flip. It does not seem to be a problem when actally casting since the sharp angle is not present. When i switched to a larger tip the problem was resolved completely.

Scott Sheets
www.smsrods.com

I'm using 17 lb stren mono.

I tried the rod with 12 lb stren and it also pitched with a lot less effort with the #7 tiptop..

I don't think my problem is at the transition but probably the problem lies after the transition. My #6 is at 4 1/2 inches from the tiptop and 9 1/2 from tiptop to 2nd size 6 guide

Thanks for all of you folks' input.

I'm reluctant to try the micro guides, until I get more proficient at this rod-building hobby.

Roy

Roy,
I think the point Steve and I are trying to make is that if you did your transition to the bottom correctly you should be having no problem with those sized lines. A size 6 is MORE than large enough to pitch with little to no effort. What spiral system are you using, what guides sizes, and what spacing?

Scott Sheets
www.smsrods.com

I ran into an issue last season where I would get an occasional hang in my pitch when I was using a size 3 guide. It took a while but I narrowed the problem down to the stiffness of the line cauing it to rub the blank, and pinch in the size 3 ring when making the sharp angle and the beginning of a pitch or flip. It does not seem to be a problem when actally casting since the sharp angle is not present. When i switched to a larger tip the problem was resolved completely.

Scott,

This is exactly the situation that I was thinking about with my first reply.

Joe

Scott

I am not using any particular system. I was given a rod and asked to convert it to spiral wrap. The guide closest to the handle (12) was left in place. I stripped the other guides off and bent the rod until I could see a defined curvature. I marked that point as where the transition was going to and installed a (8) guide there, this guide would be 180 degrees from the number (12) guide. Two (10) guides were then installed to make an even transition to the (8) guide. I put a (6) 4 1/2 inches from the tiptop. I put all number(6) guides spaced incrementally larger to the (8), and then 2 coats of finish was applied.
A good quality reel was installed (Shimano Calais 4 x 8). The distance was not there and accuracy was inconsistent The tiptop was removed and a number 7 was installed. Distance was there and accuracy was consistent. Now I am lost as to why this helped

I have another 7 footer ready for guides with casting handle installed.. since there are other folks getting distance and consistency with a number 6 tip top. I guess my move would be to install a number 6 tiptop and tape my guides and experiment.

Thanks everyone for your replies.

Roy Z



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 02/24/2009 10:39AM by Roy Zeringue.