I have a friend that wants a "Goliath" Grouper rod. He recently bought what looks to be a rod built on a Gator Glass Gaff stick, no action what so ever, the equivalent of fishing with a telephone pole. He hooked one from the rod holder the other day that he had to cut the line because the fiberglass was flexing so much around the rod holder that it was going to break the gunnel off the side of the boat.

Has anyone built a rod for this type of fishing. We are talking 300lb+ grouper with 12/0 Penn Senators. What blank will stand up to this abuse?

If he is fighting from a rod holder on a 12/0 locked down, use a bent butt IGFA 80/130 class otherwise you will break the rod.

Holding it by hand, the Gator Glass KC50-86 cut to 6' should stand up to any abuse he can physically give it. Do tie him to a rope if he is holding it as I have personally witnessed people go over the side while trying not to lose their equipment. End result is they are wet and still have no equipment.

He was trying to get it out of the holder, just couldn't because of the stress. Have you built that GG before. I'm thinking if I cut over a foot off the tip it will end up being the same as his current rod with no action. If I trim it off the butt it might not have enough "backbone" to hold up to these fish.

The KC50 is a very moderate action rod an I've built on it more than a few times. Cutting it should drop it to moderate-slow.

You could also goto a GATOR-XH or XH55 standup style rod, but with those I would put him in a harness and fight it that way. Goliaths are true brutes.

The last option would be to fish with the same rod, but out of the holder, in freespool with the clicker on. This is not the ideal solution, but it will work.

Which exact blank was he fishing with that is made by GG? They do not make a specific gaff blank as far as I know.

I wouldnt get out the gator glass line personally on that type of rod.

Edit >> Maybe the heavier Eglass calstars would work as well.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 09/09/2008 11:07AM by Sean Cheaney.

He didn't know what type of rod it was. I thought it was a Gator because it was unfinished and looks like a Gator.

I think the rod he is currently using was cut from the tip because the tip size is HUGE. But it takes a lot to put even a slight bend in the rod. HE wants the rod to be able to adequatly load rather than just putting a small flex in the rod.

In that case, calstar stand up stick. Keep in mind you need to be fishing 20-30# of drag coming off the REEL for these fish.

Thanks for your help Sean

We now have the politically correct fish - I grew up calling these "Jewfish" and somewhere in the semi-recent past they renamed them to Goliath Grouper.

I like the Calstar stick for these. You need something similar to what we use here for offshore tuna (up to 800#) but without the run, although once they sound it's very much like fighting the Grouper.

Uncle Russ
Calico Creek Rods

Bin anything over 5'6" unless intending to use the rail & sitting on the butt.
Bin anything without a fast taper.
Bin anything 80-130 without a chair & harness.
If no chair & intending stand-up:
Short fast taper stand-up tuna blank 80# max ( cut @ the butt to fit equivalent length bent butt) & a kidney type harness is the way to go to maximise the hurt on the beastie & minimise the hurt on the fisher.
Anything over 80#class blank and the fisher will not be able to effectively put in the effort, standing up ,to load the rod properly & will be at an effort to output disadvantage compared to a lighter class blank.
Good luck to the B&D slave & photo of the beastie caught is mandatory.

DenisB

I think I need some clarification. The only Bin I've heard of is a terrorist. Is Bin good or bad?

Bin as in "Toss in Bin ".

Definitely Bad.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 09/10/2008 03:15AM by Denis Brown.

Why would I "Bin" anything without a fast taper? I build a lot of grouper rods just never anything this heavy and moderate actions are typically preffered.

I would use a standup fast and short stick in this case because you want all that leverage. For that same reason bent butt is likely the way to go here. Basically here the angler and rod in combination's job is to stop the grouper from making it home. Once that happens it a tuna death spiral fight for the most part.

I build a lot of grouper rods as well, but a goliath rod is more like a deep drop rod but something that is physically sustainable to hold.

It's unclear to me how a fast taper gives the angler more leverage? I understand the short rod taking away a leverage advantage to the fish and the advantage of the bent butt, but why the fast taper?

Shuts off quickly and harnesses the power of the rod. Thats why I prefer the standup style rod to a moderate or slow action rod. Personally I can whip a bottom fish much faster on a stand up style blank than any other out there.

The bent butt vs straight will also be determined by his harness as well.

How does it harness the power of the rod? I'm not doubting you just trying to better understand. It was my understanding that a slower action rod would better harness the power of the rod as the shutoff point is lower on the rod and the majority of the pressure from the fish would be on a thicker segment of the rod as compared to a fast action rod where the rod tip would be subject to the greatest pressure? Also a slower action rod would further reduce the fish's leverage advantage.

Just use a granade..........

Sorry, I couldn't resist.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 09/10/2008 06:37PM by kevin knox.

Kevin, as soon as they open a season on them I will.

Scott Youschak Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> How does it harness the power of the rod? I'm not
> doubting you just trying to better understand. It
> was my understanding that a slower action rod
> would better harness the power of the rod as the
> shutoff point is lower on the rod and the majority
> of the pressure from the fish would be on a
> thicker segment of the rod as compared to a fast
> action rod where the rod tip would be subject to
> the greatest pressure? Also a slower action rod
> would further reduce the fish's leverage
> advantage.

Scott,
You have a number of competing issues here.
rod strong enough for the job
slow action vs fast action.
A slow action rod with enough power for the job will have a steady curve to the rod & a significant 'direct line distance' at the angle of the butt section in the loaded shape between the tip & the butt. and power is transmitted throughout the length of the rod relatively evenly throughout that length as the pressure on the rod increases.
A fast action fast taper rod in a fairly heavy line class has quite a bit of power at the tip but the power increases significantly as the blank is deflected ( loaded ) and the point of most power transmission moves closer to the butt because the tip tends to flatten out more inline with the line to fish.

The effective distance between the tip & the butt in the fully loaded rod ( in the direction of the butt section) is less in a fast taper fast action rod than in a slow taper rod & most of the power transmission is taking place in a smaller section of the rod closer to the fisher in a fast taper blank whereas a slower taper blank transmits power more evenly throughout its length .
So the fisher is having to put out less effort in a fast taper rod than a slow taper rod to get the same "pull" on the fish.
In the case of knock-down-drag-out fishing this equates to more " pull" against the fish being able to be generated by the fisher for the effort being expended & therefore greater maximum pull on the fish at the maximum the fisher can pull at.
Another thing that occurs is that the fast taper rod near its designed power rating increases its power transmission with less additional deflection of the rod in similar line class rods compared to a slow taper rod , so when you pull extra on a fast taper rod the effect of lifting the fish is more than with a slower action rod ( where a lot of the effort disappears in bending the rod more..........rather than effectively lifting the fish.)
A few simplifications in the explanation, but hope that helps you understand a bit better the perspective of where the recommendations of many of the responses to your query are coming from.
DenisB

I'm glad you could explain that. I know why and how, but the explanation of it is harder than just putting it in someones hand and asking them to pull on both.