G'day Guys,

I rebuilt a boat rod in simple spiral style and put a Daiwa SL47SH level wind reel on it. It appears that the spiral is causing the line to stack to one side of the spool, the same side that the bumper guide is on.

The stripper is a BHNLG20, the bumper and all the rest of the guides are single foot Fuji BLBLG10. The BLBLG is not a very low guide and I reckon this is causing the problem.

I am guessing that this would not be a problem with a non-level wind reel.

Is there anything I can do on the next rod to fix this, or is it just a function of using level winds with spirals? Could I go back to using a BLG fly guide as the bumper as this would keep the line much closer to the blank?

Cheers

Jason

You can try tilting your striper to the right if you spiral to the left. How much will depend on the reel. Try it with the reel and keep moving it until it winds level. Mark it there and then wrap it. Actually your trying to get the line to come back on the reel through the reel centerline so the angle to each side is the same. If you have ever used a line winder to load a levelwind reel you'll know what I mean.

Yes, it would be a problem on any reel, level wind or not, and with any type of spiral wrap. Any time you take the line off to one side of the spool this is what happens. As Jim mentioned, one possible fix is to shift the butt guide to the side opposite the spiral so that the line rides against the side of the guide ring so that it is on the 0 axis. This keeps the oncoming line approaching the reel from dead center and normally fixes this problem.

The offset butt guide is one of the components of Rich Forhan's Revolver Rod - to keep the line from stacking on one side of the reel when used with certain hard pulling crankbaits.

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Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 05/06/2008 08:22AM by Tom Kirkman.

Thanks for the advice guys.

On a rod that is non level wind could you use this to your advantage to help lay line i.e. the line wants wander to one side of the reel so you only have to push it one way and let itself wander back?

Jason

Exactly. Your thumb is stronger pushing line on the pad than pulling it on the nail, so for a right handed guy you'd spiral to the left and for left handed you'd spiral to the right.

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Would using the smallest butt guide possible lessen the line's tendency to pile up on one side? Or at least lessen the amt of offset necessary?

I just built one with a simple spiral & it works great. I used a #8 ring on a single foot fly guide with a Forhan finish wrap to help keep it on. I'm not having any problems with line building up on my level wind reel. It's a Daiwa coastal. I been using the rod for top water spook fishing for trout & reds. I found in testing various size guides & guide frames the 8 single foot work best for casting distance.

Hope this helps. In fact I have another in production right now I was really impressed with the simple spiral.

Chris,

Yes, because in effect it would move the line coming onto the reel closer to an exact 0 degree axis. The larger the ring, the further from that axis the line is starting from.

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Some reels will pile line to one side when used with any spiral wrap. It has to do with their particular level wind mechanism (it only need to hang for an instant on one side to create line stacking or piling to one side). It also happens with some particular lures that pull very hard.


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Tom,
I am building my first spiral wrap for a rod to be used inshore for fishing salmon and bottom fish. I am using a simple spiral. I have located the bumper guide on the left and the Penn level wind reel has the handle on the right. Based on this original thread I am assuming the line will stack on the left side of my reel.

Currently I placed the butt guide on the zero axis and the line touches the butt guide ring on the left, the bumper guide on th bottom and the next guide on the top og the ring. If I move the butt guide from the 0 axis slightly to the right, the line will be brought more to theleft side of the ring on the guide. But this should also bring the line closer to the center of the reel when line is retrieved. Conversely, if I move the butt guide more to the left, the line should be more "centered" in the ring as line is retrieved. [If my writing sounds confused, it is because it reflects the confusion in my mind.] The conclusion I have drawn is that I should move my Butt guide to the right to lessen stacking of the line on the reel. Please enlighten me. Thanks.

Mike Blomme

Mike; You got it right. You want the line to center on the reel.

Yes, just like Jim says, but try it first as is - the line won't necessarily stack off to one side. This is something that only happens with some reels and some lures.

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Another technique is to use a small oval-shaped stripper guide, which restricts the side-to-side effect even further.

Uncle Russ
Calico Creek Rods

I have to agree with Tom on this in that "This is something that only happens with some reels and some lures".

I specifically build bass rods and all most always offset my stripper guides, with out any stacking problems.

Most level winds used for bass fishing a rather narrow compared to some of the offshore stuff so the stacking would seem to bee more prevalent in wider reels.

Uncle Russ I like your idea just makes sense!

Guys,

Thaks again for a great discussion.

Tom, I thought that this situation may be an advantage on a non level wind reel and spiralling the way you have indicated. I also think that what you said about the levelwind "hanging" may be true in this case. The Daiwa, while quite a nice reel (but not very expensive or sophisticated), does have a fair bit of play in the mechanism and this probably causes the problem in my case. Having also used a 20 ring guide, there is a fair bit of room for sideways movement of the line. I can see that a narrow and higher quality casting reel may not have the same problem because of the width of the reel for starters and then also because of much tighter tolerances in the level wind mechanism.

Russ, I like your idea. I reckon a Fuji power oval guide would help minimise this problem and I'll definitely try that on my next heavy spiral.

Thanks for all the hints and ideas guys.

Regards

Jason

Jason,
I just finished builing several spiral wrapped rods.
In all cases, I have the guides so that the spiral to the right or clock wise around the rod - looking toward the tip from the butt. I use three guides to spiral the line from the top to the bottom of the rod.
When adjusting the placement of the butt or first guide - I have the other guides in their correct locations at 60, 120 and 180 degrees.

I start with the butt guide at 0 degrees and with a taunt line running from the tip to the rod, slowly retreive line and note if and or where the line touches the first or butt guides - as the reel retreives line moving from one side of the reel to the other.
In all cases, I find that the line will stack on one side of the line with a guide setting of 0 degrees.

I gradually rotate the butt or first guide toward the right or closer to the 120 degree rod - retesting each time. In all cases, I think that the butt or first guide ended up at about 15 degrees so that the line - during retreival - first touched one side of the guide and then the other side of the guide as the reel retreived line with its line retreival mechansim moving line back and forth across the reel.

Then, without changing any thing on the rod, I tried two other casting reels of different sizes and widths to insure that the line would still retreive cleanly with no stacking on one side of the reel or the other.
In all cases, the line retreived cleanly - moving from first one side of the first or butt guide then to the other side.

So, for my situation it appears that a guide alignment of about 15, 60 120, 180 ---- 180 is right on for these style spiral guide alignments.

Note:

I did go back and check a spiral wrapped rod that I made a couple of years ago, where I had set the first guide at 0 degrees. Sure enough, the line tended to stack on one side of the reel. When , I get around to it - if ever - I will pull off the guide and rewrape and recoat it so that it doesn't stack on the reel.

Take care
Roger

Roger,

Thanks for that. Might have to give it a try too.

Regards

Jason