I prefer the look of having the epoxy applied to the edge of the wrap and not going onto the blank, but my first attempts have usually involved a spot or two where a bit of epoxy gets on the blank. Could I have a suggestion about removing the small amount right next to the guide wrap? Or is it more usual to just overlap the epoxy onto the blank?

Also, I'm measuring my Flex Coat in the small syringes and was wondering... what is the smallest amount I can mix up at one time? I've been doing two mls of each component and with my rookie slowness there's a lot left over when it gets thick.

Thanks!
Ed

Use some lint free coffee filter paper that has been dipped into some denatured alcohol. This will give you a nice clean edge without introducing dust into the epoxy.

This link will answer your mixing questions mixing flexcoat.

flexcoat.com/measnmix.html


Thad
Dutchman's Creek Tackle

The wrap finish SHOULD be applied just beyond the wraps onto the blank about 1/8-1/4in.
This seals the wraps from moisture wicking underneith.

Raymond Adams
Eventually, all things merge, and a river runs through it..

I'm with Raymond on this. I have tried the other way and I don't like where the finish soaks the thread and leaves a ridge.

The coffee filter and alky works great. Got that idea here!



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 02/21/2007 03:52PM by Chuck Mills.

I generally roll my epoxy over the edge of the thread and onto the blank every so slightly. Something else you can do is to wait till your epoxy is setting up, then pull a string of it off (with a dubbing needle, or paper clip, etc.), and lay that "string" right up against the edge thread. Takes some practice and a steady hand, but gives a really nice edge.

I've never been able to get perfect coverage of that edge thread if I didn't overlap a little onto the blank. It always ended up just the tiniest bit starved.

If you don't use CP, then it doesn't matter whether or not you overlap--your thread will be fine regardless. But, if you use CP, you really need to overlap onto the blank. Otherwise, water will seep up underneath the finish, and get your threads wet. The overlap seals up the edge, and keeps this from happening.

Personally, I think by NOT going just over the edge would be asking for problems with moisture, condensation, etc. possibly being able to enter under the edge

Mike (Southgate, MI)
If I don't want to, I don't have to and nobody can make me (except my wife) cuz I'm RETIRED!!

By trying to mix small amounts of finish you will ask for trouble.The ratio of failures goes up with smaller amounts due to the amounts having to be more precise and a smaller margin of error.I do at least 3cc of each.Try to speed up the application.You dont have to spend a lot of time applying the wraps.Do a search here for finish application for some tips.This has been covered before.

Freddwhy (Rapt-Ryte)

I agree with Mike Barkley
With thread master I routinely mix 1.5cc of each half with out any problems. With flex coat I suggest sticking with 3cc

I with Ed on ending my finish at the wraps, at least on freshwater rods. I always work to keep finish from overlapping to the blank. I've got 12 year old hand-built rods that show no signs of rotting or other damage to the wraps or guides. It makes it easier to clean up residue during repairs or re-dos.

Ed, the first priority is to keep the finish from overlapping in the first place. I use everything from really small knitting needles to three inch hat pins to ground-down dental picks to apply finish the the edge of the wrap, before I apply finish to the rest of the wrap. It sort of acts like a border that helps define the edge when I working the finish over the rest of the wrap. I also like using PermaGloss because it is so edge-friendly, coat-after-coat. I manually apply the finish to the edge. I find it easier than trying to do fine detail work when the motor's turning the rod.

If you develop a good working method to seal the thread edge, you will rarely have to resort to cleaning up an overlap. If you do however, Micheal Shea identified an excellent "eraser", the coffee filter. I have also resorted to using old tee shirts, and pistol-cleaning patches.
I find that cutting the fiters and teeshirts in two by half inch strips allows me to bear down on any mistakes. I use no solvent to prevent contamination while the finish is wet. I try to clean the edge as sharply as possible, allow it to dry, and then using alcohol, or any other rod-friendly solvent to clean up the blank.

PS I always go the opposite way when mixing batches of finish. I usually start with a minimum of 5 ccs each to avoid any mixing mistakes. If I am looking to do a touch up, or only wish to seal guides, my go to is PermaGloss.





Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 02/21/2007 06:23PM by Patrick Vernacchio.

Thanks, Guys, for all the advice. I'm going to start "round 3" (the last section on my four piece" tonight and will follow your recommendations. I also found a place here in Denver today that sells Flex Coat finish so I have enough now to not be so stingy.
Ed

i have tried mixing 0.5cc of TM, LSS etc without any problem ..

-
Give a man a fish, he'll eat for a day..
Teach a man to fish, he'll be broke!

Ed, you can also get perfect, close edges every time by taping first with translucent 'scotch tape'. It takes 5 minutes longer to get a rod set up, but I think it pays off with the finish you can achieve. It also allows you to 'draw' the epoxy lengthwise to the exact thickness you want. I peel the tape off as soon as I'm satisfied with every wrap. As far as minimum quantities go, I regularly syringe down to 0.1ml/cc ( not a typo) of each part for minor repairs and usually complete a whole fly rod using one mix of 0.3ml/cc of each part and one mix of 0.2ml/cc of each part. That's enough for a 4 to 7 weight with single foot guides. I mix the second lot as soon as I've used up the first and there is nothing wasted. The first mix does the butt and the strippers, while the second mix does the rest. Very occasionally I'll do the butt a second time. I haven't had a failure in at least 3 years and I never need to mix for more than 30 seconds. The 'secret' is using accurate syringes (I use really thin 1ml ones I get from a vet and clean them with alcohol first time around) and mixing the epoxy while warming it slightly - I mix mine in small clean yoghurt containers that the kids have had for lunch while dipping the bottom of the container into a mug of warm water. The heat kick starts the chemical reaction and so what if it goes off a little faster, because I mix up two batches anyway! I'll probably cop some flack/scepticism over this (and no doubt the epoxy salesmen will hate me), but I don't like wasting materials and why throw away money? Jim

Ed,

Where in Denver do you get your Flex-Coat? I'm in Littleton.



Danny D. Will
Expatriated Conch

Hi
Its has been awhile since anyone replied to this topic but I will try. I am new at rod building and finishing my wraps using Bill Falconer method. I keep the finish off the blank but am finding the when it dries I get a sharpish edge and not rounding flowing.
Is this how it should be or am I doing something wrong?

Thanks
lyle

L. A. Garcia in his rod building books also did not run over the wrap edge with his finish with no apparent ill effects in saltwater fly fishing.

I believe, as in so many things about rod building, it depends on the minute details of execution whether a process will work or not. I personally think the risks of water intrusion are too great and have no problem with a little epoxy on the blank. On glossy blanks one cannot even see it.

If you are not using CP on your wraps there is less reason to extend the epoxy beyond the wrap edge. Otherwise you'd want to extend beyond the wrap edge by a tiny bit to seal off the wrap from possible water intrusion. CP will not effectively seal against water over time.

..........

There seems to be a train of thought that no resin should go past the wrap. I am not of that, even with fly rods. The main problem I have is the hard edge it makes at the blank thread interface. It will catch on any rod tube or sock. I want a smooth transition, so I go over the edge with the second coat. I apply a thin first coat right over the thread then a thicker second coat that will go evenly past the edge. I do it also for all the reasons listed above from the other builders.

You can mix the smallest amount of epoxy you want, but to be consistent and sure that your epoxy will set you need a little more than it takes. Just keep doing what you're doing if it is working. It's better to have a little waste than messed up epoxy that won't set. I usually mix 3 cc of each, no matter what, and it always comes out right.

You can use some old braided line. I took an old roll of kevlar line that I would never use and cut it in foot long lengths. When I want to clean up some epoxy, I hold the kevlar like floss and work my way around the blank where I want to clean up the epoxy. The kevlar absorbs the epoxy and you can get a nice clean edge.