Been meaning to post this for awhile. Before we left to go underway, I put the grips on a new CTS Seamaster Spin Jig Pro blank. I put the hypalon on as I always do, applying much rod bond way up above where the grip will make contact with the blank. End result is about the bottom half of the blank was covered in rod bond. I don't mind mixing up quite a bit at once, as whatever pushes down I just do the next grip on the next rod with.

Even though the rod bond started a foot above where the grip made contact with the blank at, after everything dried, the top was glued, the bottom was glued, but the middle is loose. I can't figure it out for the life of me. The grip wasn't loose. It had to stretch to go down the blank. I used one hand push down from the top of the grip to capture the rod bond as I slid the hypalon into place.

Now I have to inject some rod bond into the grip in the hopes I don't mess it up. Was wondering if anyone had any ideas why the grip wouldn't glue in the middle, even though it had to stretch a bit? I had already epoxied the reel seat into place when I found the problem, so I won't be cutting the hypalon off.

Know any good sources for epoxy syringes to use to inject rod bond? When I get home this will be one of the first blanks I try to finish.

Phil

Phil I cant really tell why the grip didnt glue ,obviosly no glue stayed in the middle of the grip or just didnt take. I would assume that the entire grip and seat assembly section of the blank was sanded to a water braek free surface. I know that I make sure that the inside of my grips are coated with epoxy as well as the blank..But it sounds like you seem to know what your doing.. so thats probly not it either. My only suggestion is that it might be hard to inject rodbond through a surynge as it is so thick., maybee since you have a good bond at both ends of the grip you could inject a thin glue in there instead and you might get away with it. I use rodbond myself but Ihave heard of some that even use woodwork glue ect...... so my piont is ; A thinner glue means a thinner syringe and you might be able to get more glue in there ....Ive fixed the odd loose grip myself by heating up some 24 hr araldite to make it thin and injecting around the loose area. another option would be to cut it off and put a new one on from the rear of the blank but that would depend on what sort of butt cap youve put on and how far it has to stretch.. IM assuming its the rear grip........Ive replaced a feww rear grips on surf rods ,going over the sand spike this way.......Anyway I hope some of this helps...........................................good luck.....

Is it possible that when you pushed the grip down that it got air in the middle??Was it rotated at the point where the epoxy was on the blank to make sure it was spread to all areas??When I push a grip down I measure before and after to make sure it is the same length .It usually needs to be streatched out after the install.As stated above use a thinner epoxy like flex coat rod builders epoxy to inject.

Freddwhy (Rapt-Ryte)

Flex coat rod builders epoxy? Never used the stuff.. will have to check it out. If I order it now, may be able to get it before I get back home. Where do you get your syringes for epoxy from?

Yeah, I spun the grip around and re-stretched it back out to normal size. I thought about the air issue too... I'm wondering if that isn't my problem, because the grip spins too easily in the middle. It feels like its not touching anything. So first thought was to remove the air, but I'm still going to have to use some sort of epoxy.

What's araldite?

Thanks for the tips,
Phil

Phil , you;d probley be able to get syringes from some of the board sponsors or maybee a pharmacy , Araldite is just a two pack epoxy from the hardware store. I liked freds thoughts on the subject and the flex coat sounds good too.....................................................

Phil, did you ream the grip first? It might have been too tight and chased some of the RodBond out. What did you use to prep the surface? I use rough grit sand paper because it makes ridges on the surface that can provide an anchor for the bond. I also use low viscosity adhesive which can seep into those scratches and ridges and provide a stronger bond. Hope this helps Shipmate, watch your port and starboard and check six!!

Jason,

Rough sandpaper, which creates scratches and gouges, actually weakens your bond. Epoxy is made to be used on smooth surfaces (properly deglossed and water break free, of course).

Check the article on the library page here on surface preparation. It was written by a person who was on the team that developed the adhesive systems and techniques for the Boeing Corporation many years ago.

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Theres alot of good information there, I'm still a little confused about how the gouges weaken the bond. The rivet analogy makes sense for metal to metal but how does it translate over to adhesive, fiberglass, and EVA/Hyp. The adhesive flows and the rivets do not. I wont argue with RQ, his credentials speak for themselves......I'm just scratching my head a little bit.

If they penetrate into the substrate, you are weakening the blank itself. Beyond that, epoxy is formulated to bond across a broad, smooth area, not down into valleys and peaks. A thinner glue line is stronger, so flat, smooth surfaces allow for a thinner bond.

If you're not getting into the substrate, I doubt you're hurting anything and your bonds will be fine. But they could be better, if you desire them to be.

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Makes sense, Thanks Tom.

I should mention that there are some gap filling epoxies that don't require a thin glue line. But they're generally not well suited to rod building tasks because they are so heavy bodied.

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Could you elaborate on "glue line" Tom? I'm not sure what you mean by that.

i have used flex coat glue, its thin. i now use rod smith for most of my glueing. its thick. it sets up in half the time of rod bond and is about half the thickness. i had trouble wit flex coat running where it wasnt wanted, rod smith stays in place. at least it works good for fresh water rods . stan

When you glue to pieces together, some glue will remain in the joint. The width of this is the glue line thickness. Although epoxy does not require clamping of the parts, most of the popular ones used for rod building work best when the parts fit snugly and the glue line is thin.

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OK, I was tracking in that direction but wasnt sure. Thx