I've seen several illustrations of factory floats rods to get an idea about the handle design. Besides an 18" one piece cork with sliding rings (which I do not like), most of them have about a 7"-8" lower grip, a reel seat, and a 7"-8" foregrip or something to that affect.

Once I establish a guide layout on this Talon 13' 3-piece blank, I plan to wrap and finish the upper two sections and then use those finished pieces along with the butt section to position my grips and reel seat to balance it the way I want.

Since I've never used a float rod, why would I need such a long lower grip? I'm thinking of a fighting butt with a 4" lower grip, a nice Struble saltwater reel seat with a single cork ring as a foregrip. Then place a small diameter full wells grip further up the blank (like a split grip) where ever it balances the rod the way I want. Will this be ok or is there something special I have to do to accomodate for a float rod? I will be using an Islander Steelheader center pin. Thanks.

I personally would not like the split fore grip idea.(although it would look cool) You will need the fore grip to cast the rod. I personally prefer a butt grip of about 5 or 6 inches and a fore grip of about 8 inches. I would assemble the grip 1st on the butt section, but dont apply the butt yet. Wrap and finish the rod. Next put your islander(wihch weights a shad less than 8 oz) on the rod, than check the ballance. If the rod needs to be ballanced out you can epoxy pieces of pencil lead into the butt of the blank until it weights out properly, than put on the butt. This is how i've done it and it works out well. you will most likley have to weight out the butt do to the top heavyness of a 13 ft rod, although those talons are very light, with a light titanium guide it might not be an issue. I have not used a talon blank yet, i just ordered one. 11'6" 3 pc. I hope this helps

Check out R.B. Meiser Rods. This should give you some good ideas. I have one 20' float that the guy wants a 12" butt and 10" foregrip.

Thanks Danny but I do not want to add any pencil lead to balance this rod. If I have to, I'll put the reel seat up against the figthing butt, put the rear grip "in front" of the reel seat, and put the full wells (foregrip) where ever it needs to be to balance it. Adding pencil weight would defeat the purpose of having a lightweight setup. Thanks.

Maybe an aluminum butt like this one may help to balance it
[www.fishsticks4u.com]

The long rear grip and foregrip is to do with the way the rod is cast, particularly if it is fished with a centrepin reel. The rod is held at the foregrip and the butt is trapped against the forearm. The line is controlled by the other hand, so doesn't touch the reargrip. The rig is then swung out single handed, and the other hand feeds the line (kinda like pitching). The reel then takes the tension and spins to release line. With a spinning reel it's cast in the same motion, but with a more conventional grip.

The length of the rod makes it impossible to balance with as short a reargrip as you are planning. The rod is not held or fished like a fly rod. You will need to mend line or raise the rod to keep line off the water, and the foregrip against the forearm makes this easy and painless. Also allows bracing to counteract the leverage a long rod allows a fish to exert on you.

Tim

If you build the rod the way you are describing then by noon hour of the first day you fish it you will want to rebuild it. I would take the butt end of you blank and place it at your elbow withyour arm bent as if you were fishing. Where your pinky rests should be the front edge of your Islander reel. Mark that point on your blank and work from there.

You can adjust from there slightly. I would add a 7-9 inch fore grip. Before you glue your butt cap on I would try the rod for a while. You may wish to add lead into the blank to off set the long rod. Your wrist gets mighty sore from holding the rod tip up for 7 hours

Rolly Beenen
Rovic Custom Rods

Danny, I wasn't giving a smart guy comment, but to say "to do a split grip is just stupid" seems like one. The factory specs on a 13' Talon ITM is 3.1 ozs, mine happens to check in at 2.8 ozs so I'd like to build it without adding weight in the butt end. I plan to use Fuji TASG and TLSG guides to keep weight at a minimum.

I built a GLoomis 11' 6" GLX 8/9wt a few years back and the factory version had a 5" lower grip and an 8" upper with the reelseat in between. I didn't like that look. So I mounted a Struble reelseat up against a Sage fighting butt, took two full wells grips, cut the top off of one, the bottom off the other , married them together to make an 11 1/2" double hump wells grip. With the fighting butt on my waist and both hands on the grip above the reelseat, it gives all the control and power fighting Salmon I could ask for. And because it's "balanced", it casts easily with one hand.

Like I said, I'll finish the upper two sections first so I know exactly how much weight I'm dealing with - I just don't want to add lead in the butt end if I can avoid it. Maybe I will build it with a split grip - and the beauty of it is I CAN rebuild it later if I don't like it. Thanks for all the help guys.

maybe a split grip using wood would help in the balance. I'm thinking on the butt end.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 06/08/2006 08:25AM by bill boettcher.

If you use a single cork ring at the front of the reel seat where is your hand going to be when you are fighting a fish. You need to use your one hand as the drag on the reel.

Rolly Beenen
Rovic Custom Rods

Danny,

With a small foregrip this will force you into using one hand position all day long on this rod...fighting fish and casting etc. I wouldn't like this situation. The reason guys use the slide rings is to be able to balance different reels on one rod... not all that pretty but they are functional and very light w/o the reelseat hardware.

Like Bill suggests I would use the split grip on the butt (not that cork weighs very much). I think you will lose some strength in the butt without the handle supporting the blank for it's length...this will matter fighting large fish. I think you should consider this....it's one thing to like the look of something over another but if it is less functional at the end of the day are you gaining something?

Being that long it is going to be hard to balance well. Maybe slide some hardware on seat some cork sections that you can tape in different positions and take it out side swing it around as if fishing and see how it feels. You can move the sections of cork and tape in different positions.

Here's my .02 and I only own a dozen float rods from 11.5-17". The rods from 14 and below, I use about an 8-9" rear grip...(depending on the lenght of your forearm) and rods over 14', I use a 12" rear grip. Logic for the long grip is that I'm resting the butt end of the rod on my hip, and not against my forearm. I'm building a 14' 9/10 Rainshadow Spey blank into a float rod for Chinooks and used a 12 rear grip. Reason is these fish as you know are huge and most of the time my rod will be reating on my hip given this fishing scenario. Also, our Chinooks up here are from "Jurassic Park"...LOL. Have a greta day fellow floater...Good luck!

"Long Drifts"
Paul

Thanks Paul for explaining it that way - and to Joe for reminding me "function over looks" - duh.

Paul - with a 8"-9" rear grip on a 13' float rod, what is the length of your foregrip ahead of the reelseat?? Thanks.

Tim

Tim,
Here is another basically "strictly float angler"'s opinion on the build. Most of the float anglers I fish with and myself included like about a 20" to 24" overall length in the handle. The handle built w/ the longer foregrip and the shorter butt is because it aids in balancing the outfit out and it is born of function. Whether you use a centerpin or you use a spinning reel, having a longer foregrip will help make the tip lifted to some degree in your hand, as the reel will act as a counterweight (counterbalance)behind your hand. Again, whether you fish a spinning reel or a pin, 99% of the time you will choose to hold the rod just in front of the reel, so if there is no handle there (your split grip idea) you will just be holding your blank, and as Rolly said, you will be rebuilding it, in, I say, three drifts vs, Rollys generous 7hrs. When you fish a pin your hand has to be on the reel at all times as you need to control the free spinning movement of the spool. I strive for the lightest rods possible also, BUT I always put lead in the butt of the blank, as it is much easier to deal with OVERALL weight of the rod vs TIPWEIGHT, and there is a huge difference. To that, here are my handle measurements that I find myself goin to time and time again, unless someone wants something different. Butts are generally 10 inches total to the foot of the reel, this includes butt cap, cork, spacer, The reel seat w/ wood spacer and foregrip adds another total 12" Which will give about 22-23" grip. I won't even go into the casting logistics, as there are so many variations to a centerpin cast. BUT I will say this--I DONT side cast, I pullcast and sometimes spin cast and I have found that either way you cast, the theory of using a longer foregrip and a shorter butt always works. Remember too, that the longer you make the handle the more you are killing a lot of that "soft" action that many float anglers like in their rods. Wanna keep your rod as light as possible, use 3/0 thread, REC recoils for the 8's that you will throw on the tip, and use TATSG's (10, 12, 16, 20)for the rest, as this combination is handsdown the lightest there is. Run one./two coat of preserve if you want to keep color of thread, and run one coat of epoxy on tip sections, and either use a high build for the butt, or run acouple coats of light. I use flex coat lite, but as soon as I run out of it, I will be going to Threadmaster, as there are just too many good things on it...

TIM COLLINS...

No problem sir. On my 13'ers, I use about a 71/2"-8" fore grip. Also, I concur 100% with Tim Rumlow-that your hand is most always ahead of the reel when using a "pin". As a matter of fact, I can't think of a situation when I haven't had my hand ahead of the reel preparing to grab the spool to set the hook when the float goes down....(Isn't that a great sight-the float going down?)

As far as leadb in the handle, I'm not sold on it yet. I have a 15' Saxon float rod, and the guy who built it placed lead in the handle. If I compare it to my other 15'er's, it's not the 15'er I pick first. Here's the way I see it when I build a rod...If it is not a rod that Iw ant to grab first, or if I don't have to "ponder" which 15'er I'm going to use, then I didn't build the one that gets left behind the correct way to my liking. Does that make sense to ya?

I'm gonna use Tim Rumlow's idea on guide types-I think he's right on the money and has forgotten more than I'll ever know, so lets keep milking him for knowledge! LOL!!!! And I like Tim R, will be switching to Threadmaster as well...Man, all great float minds think alike!!!

Long Drifts....

Paul