I hope this question make sense. I have a couple of Seeker stand up blanks that are to be spiral wrapped. These blanks are fast action and have considerable taper and a small, 9.0, tip. When the blank is fully loaded there is a definite point on the blank where the slope of the deflection changes abruptly and is quite significant. When setting up the guides a Fuji 16 double foot boat guide almost perfectly straddles the area where the deflection slope changes. The rod will not be set up as a bumper but more like the Forhan set up with a - 7 degree first guide. I am a little worried that the guide foot of this one particular guide can dig in to the blank when fully loaded. Since this is a spiral wrap with the guides on the bottom of the arc is there any chance at all that the stiffness of the guide frame could contribute to any type of blank failure in the area. I will be underwrapping and using layered finishing on the wraps. Should I consider shifting the guides or not worry about any problems. On IGFA blanks with a a more consistant arc and guides on top do not present the same conditions as above.

Depending on the type frame style you use, you'd hope the guide frame would flex and not harm the blank. I don't think any harm will be done. And, although you may put the blank into a heavy bend, take a close look at the small length that will be occupied by the guide. How much is that little 1 inch or so length really flexing?

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I am using the Turbo Style and the frame length is 1 5/8". The guide is quite sturdy but does seem to have a little flexibility. I think I will shift it a little to move slightly off center of this area of the blank. I was just wondering if anyone has had a failure that could be related. The other tuna sticks that I have used are the slower blanks and all have been conventional guide set ups. I just do not want this first spiral rod fail for this charter captain.

If you're talking about the double leg type, and not the triple leg, I don't think you'll have any problem.

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Bill – You may have already finished this rod. … Have you thought of using the Fuji Heavy-duty FLY guides, the LBSG or the BLBLG (16-12-10-8mm). These are both Single-Foot, TRI-LEGGED, Low-Height Ceramic-Ring Guide Frames. A much shorter foot-print than any Turbo guide of similar ring size.

The Fuji LBSG is a Gunsmoke colored SS-Frame with the SiC (Silicon Carbide) Ring. And the Fuji BLBLG is a Black colored SS-Frame with the Hard-Loy (Aluminum Oxide) Ring.

The more I think about heavy-duty, stiff-frame, LONG FOOT-PRINT guides being placed UNDER heavy-duty FAST-Taper rod blanks, as part of a Spiral Wrap configuration, the more it begs the question you asked here, Bill Stevens: Doesn’t the guide’s toes “digging” into the rod blank or the guide frame’s arch excessively stiffening the rod’s arc seem like a reasonable possibility?

Boat Guide frames (like the Fuji LRSG or BLRLG) were designed by the manufacturers for use on the OUTSIDE of the bent rod’s arc. Now, when we are doing Spiral Wraps, we expect the same performance from the line guide while trying to bend the guide frame in the opposite arc. A shorter foot-print length and / or a more flexible frame for a Spiral Wrap Running Guide would be useful, especially on a faster-taper rod blank. A single-foot guide that is sturdy enough for Stand-Up Tuna fishing, like the Fuji LBSG or BLBLG, seems to make more sense than a long foot-print Turbo guide in the tip section, for a Spiral Wrapped Rod. IMO, – See below – . –Cliff Hall+++

Re: Determining single vs. double foot guides? Dave Barrett 12-21-05 09:17
[www.rodbuilding.org]
You build bass rods. I build stand up tuna rods. So take that into consideration when I say that any rod to be fished with 80# line or less gets single foot guides. For me that means LBSGs which are SIC heavy duty boat guides. I've fought many tuna using 35# of drag with these guides on a spiral wrapped rod without problem. Since a double foot guide dampens the action of the blank more than a single foot guide, why use the double when its just not needed? There, you have my take, I'm sure others will disagree. Merry Christmas everyone! Dave Barrett

Re: Determining single vs. double foot guides? Tom Kelly 12-21-05 13:05
Cliff... The LBSG guides referenced are indeed Fuji HD single-footed SIC guides. Cut & paste the following web location to view Mudholes ad for them.
[shop.mudhole.com] Tom Kelly.

Bill – You may have already finished this rod. … Have you thought of using the Fuji Heavy-duty FLY guides, the LBSG or the BLBLG (16-12-10-8mm). These are both Single-Foot, TRI-LEGGED, Low-Height Ceramic-Ring Guide Frames. A much shorter foot-print than any Turbo guide of similar ring size.

The Fuji LBSG is a Gunsmoke colored SS-Frame with the SiC (Silicon Carbide) Ring. And the Fuji BLBLG is a Black colored SS-Frame with the Hard-Loy (Aluminum Oxide) Ring.

The more I think about heavy-duty, stiff-frame, LONG FOOT-PRINT guides being placed UNDER heavy-duty FAST-Taper rod blanks, as part of a Spiral Wrap configuration, the more it begs the question you asked here, Bill Stevens: Doesn’t the guide’s toes “digging” into the rod blank or the guide frame’s arch excessively stiffening the rod’s arc seem like a reasonable possibility?

Boat Guide frames (like the Fuji LRSG or BLRLG) were designed by the manufacturers for use on the OUTSIDE of the bent rod’s arc. Now, when we are doing Spiral Wraps, we expect the same performance from the line guide while trying to bend the guide frame in the opposite arc. A shorter foot-print length and / or a more flexible frame for a Spiral Wrap Running Guide would be useful, especially on a faster-taper rod blank. A single-foot guide that is sturdy enough for Stand-Up Tuna fishing, like the Fuji LBSG or BLBLG, seems to make more sense than a long foot-print Turbo guide in the tip section, for a Spiral Wrapped Rod. IMO, – See below – . –Cliff Hall+++

Re: Determining single vs. double foot guides? Dave Barrett 12-21-05 09:17
[www.rodbuilding.org]
You build bass rods. I build stand up tuna rods. So take that into consideration when I say that any rod to be fished with 80# line or less gets single foot guides. For me that means LBSGs which are SIC heavy duty boat guides. I've fought many tuna using 35# of drag with these guides on a spiral wrapped rod without problem. Since a double foot guide dampens the action of the blank more than a single foot guide, why use the double when its just not needed? There, you have my take, I'm sure others will disagree. Merry Christmas everyone! Dave Barrett

Re: Determining single vs. double foot guides? Tom Kelly 12-21-05 13:05
Cliff... The LBSG guides referenced are indeed Fuji HD single-footed SIC guides. Cut & paste the following web location to view Mudholes ad for them.
[shop.mudhole.com] Tom Kelly.