I have read the posts, searched and read the library and I am still confused.
I understand surface prep, tinting permagloss and thats about all. How do you apply with a coffee filter? Exactly? Same for a rubber or sponge with a hole on it?
Can I air brush permagloss or is that impracticall?
I would like to do some of the colors I see on television that fade from shade to shade.
Yellows to greens, blues and pinks to orchids, orandes to reds, no harsh lines of color changes but subtle color changes, etc. The orchids on the tail of Hawaii Airlines planes, the butterfly greens and blues on the Nuesta commercials. The backgrounds and graphics of even local newscasts. What type of paint should I spray that would hold up to finish clear coat of permagloss to protect it after I acheive the disired effect. And would not fade or be effected by UV rays? The colors I want run from pastels to Irridecents to neons. I have a well equiped climate controlled shop including conventenial aswell as air brush paint systems so I can try about anything. I just need some of you to help me get started without repeating common mistakes and give me the best chance at success.
I appreciate all help or point me to the resource. I will talk on the phone, 281-855-3933, or e-mail, dougcasey@houston.rr.com, or replies to this post.
Thanks to all of you who contribute to this forum and to you Tom for providing it.
Doug Casey
Houston Texas

Check into the PPG 2 part auto paints. They are made to spray but will be costly. Auto Body Supply stores in your area should be able to give you info. Even Dupont
[www.google.com]

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Hello there, you want to apply as few coats as possible to keep the weight and thickness down on your blank. There are some aerosol paints at the auto parts stores you can check out but if your looking for the color change or color shift effect check out The House of Kolor website. They offer airbrush paints that are premixed and ready to spray. Many of the questions your asking can be answered there. They also sell a book on custom painting for about 20 bucks which is worth the money it will save you in trial and error, be forewarned color shift paints are expensive! Regards, Jerry Springs

First, you can spray Perma Gloss from an airbrush, but be prepared to experiment with your needle/tip size. Too fine of a tip will result in a "pebble" type finish rather than the smooth gloss you're probably after. Line pressure will play a part in this as well, but 35lbs. is a good starting point. If you don't have a respirator, spray in a well ventilated area or the "buzz" will stay with you for a while!

As for paint, we've had VERY good luck with a brand called "Pactra". It's made for Lexan R/C car bodies. Pactra has a great flex agent in it and we've yet to have it ever crack or check on a rod blank. You can find it online or at your local Hobby Shop. It's available in either aerosol cans, or bottles to use with your airbrush. It also makes a great tint for marbling. Nice color selection too including candys & metallics.

Mark Griffin
[]
C&M Custom Tackle
San Dimas, California



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 04/07/2006 03:15PM by Mark Griffin.

Been checking them out on line. Interesting. Thanks for the info Mark.

Is this stuff real hard or are you permaglossing the spray cans ?



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 04/07/2006 01:32PM by bill boettcher.

You need Perma Gloss over the Pactra to keep it from scratching. Perma Gloss is applied over either spray can or air brushed Pactra. The solvents & propellent in the spray cans doesn't react to the Perma Gloss at all.

Also, Pactra is "flat", so the Perma Gloss on top will actually create a gloss finish. When they use Pactra on R/C car bodies, they're painting INSIDE the clear Lexan body, so the shiny finish you see on the outside of the car's body is actually the shiny finish on the Lexan. They do this to protect the paint as these little things get pretty banged up. My boys have broken more flexible R/C car bodies over the years than I could even count and even on those the Pactra never cracked or checked.

Mark Griffin
[]
C&M Custom Tackle
San Dimas, California

You need Perma Gloss over the Pactra to keep it from scratching. Perma Gloss is applied over either spray can or air brushed Pactra. The solvents & propellent in the spray cans doesn't react to the Perma Gloss at all.

Also, Pactra is "flat", so the Perma Gloss on top will actually create a gloss finish. When they use Pactra on R/C car bodies, they're painting INSIDE the clear Lexan body, so the shiny finish you see on the outside of the car's body is actually the shiny finish on the Lexan. They do this to protect the paint as these little things get pretty banged up. My boys have broken more flexible R/C car bodies over the years than I could even count and even on those the Pactra never cracked or checked.

Mark Griffin
[]
C&M Custom Tackle
San Dimas, California

Mark,
Question about Pactra (made by Testor's). They make it in acrylic and lacquer and I don't know anything about painting, but I know that acrylics have proven to be pretty disastrous when use in marbling although I would guess that the laquer might work if you let it settle enough to pour off the solvents. The web site says over and over that it's made for the INSIDE of lexan car bodies. Why inside? Obviously, I don't know anything about models either.
Also, as fast as PG cures, how do you keep from wrecking you spray equipment??

Oops! Typing at the same time, Mark!!!


Mike (Southgate, MI)
If I don't want to, I don't have to and nobody can make me (except my wife) cuz I'm RETIRED!!



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 04/07/2006 03:23PM by Mike Barkley.

That's why if you want the best and can spray the paint get the auto clears and paints. I have used either the Plasti-Kote or Dupli Color paints and then permagloss over that for a hard finish.

Heck, just go to GUSA and have them painted what ever color you want. At the prices they charge it is not worth doing your own.



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 04/07/2006 05:44PM by bill boettcher.

One of my favourite rods is one i painted and clear coated with kamelon (changes color from different directions) auto paint. But then I also love working with acrylic marbling (works just fine for me), so can't be right. Not a suggestion, not a recommendation, just a VOC.

Mike, the bottles are at home and I'm not! I'm 99-1/2% sure it's acrylic. We can't buy lacquer in Cali. If I get home and I'm wrong, I'll post again, but since I clean this paint out of the gun with tap water, i don't think it could be anything but acrylic.

As to cleaning up the whole process, the Perma Gloss is the only part of this that takes some extra clean-up work on the gun. In fact, you have to keep an eye on the gun's tip as you're shooting it as it can build up and actually start to spatter. That's shooting a LOT of Perma Gloss (5+ feet) before it's an issue and it's simply a matter of wiping the tip off to remove any build-up. Thus far I've only used brush cleaner to clean the gun after the Perma Gloss and have never had a "dried gunk" issue.

As for marbling, that's my Son Mike's department! He's never had any issues with the Pactra as a pigment other than some colors work better than others which seems to be the case with just about any paint line. No reactions or anything of that nature though. As far as pouring off solvent, I don't think he does anymore. Depending on the effect or color he needs, he just dips his pick (he uses a dental pick) in the bottle mid-way, or roots around the bottom of the bottle for a deeper "tone". He never shakes the bottle or mixes the paint. Again, I'm 99% on this, but will verify & correct if need be.

Auto paint. Has anyone had success WITHOUT adding a flex agent to it? That's the stuff they add to the paint for the new flexible car bumpers. I tried to get a quart of PPG Candy Red enamel (remember, we can't but lacquer in Cali) a couple of years back and by the time I bought the base tint, the color and added flex agent to both, it was going to run $150. Needless to say, I passed....

Painting inside th car bodies? Mainly just because those little cars usually spend as much time on their roofs as they do their wheels! Some of those things move in excess of 50MPH, so the paint job would go away pretty quickly if it weren't on the inside of the clear body. They get a little mind numbing to paint too when you have six colors, stripes, etc, etc, etc... and have to paint it all in reverse! By the way, even nitromethane R/C fuel doesn't bother the Pactra.

Mark Griffin
[]
C&M Custom Tackle
San Dimas, California



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 04/07/2006 10:38PM by Mark Griffin.

Thanks, Mark! I haven't personally had any problem with the few times that I used acrylic for marbling but it seems like the minute that you mention acrylics, people go nuts with horror stories so I just haven't used it much.

How come you can't buy lacquer in california? What do body shops use?


Mike (Southgate, MI)
If I don't want to, I don't have to and nobody can make me (except my wife) cuz I'm RETIRED!!

Jimmy, GUSA is an acronym for Graphite USA.

By the way, you may want to add your last name to your account or your posts will be removed. You have to list your first AND last name to participate on the board. Just a heads up for ya.

Jay

Rumor has it that good ol' Ken Preston is working on an article for RodMaker dealing with blank coloring. If you haven't seen his samples at the Rod Builders Show, you've missed a treat. Most impressive is his technique using the Alsa Spectra FX color-shift paint additive. At Ken's advice, I bought a little jar of the stuff. If my wife finds out how much it cost, I'm referring her to Ken.

Pete Kornegay
Camden, NC

Call it politics Mike. It's an Air Quality issue (that or Barbara Boxer kept sniffing the stuff). Most of the good stuff you can get elsewhere has to be water based here. Even contact cement! Come to think of it, I have a water based lacquer on my Kitchen cabinets. Don't recall ever seeing water based lacquer paint however. But even this water based wood finish has to be sprayed with HVLP equipment if you're spraying more than a pint a day, or something like that. Body shops are using acrylic enamel to the best of my knowledge and their spray booths are getting constant inspections from the AQMD (air quality management district) .

This has been going on for 15-20 years now and has driven a lot of industry out of here. I guarantee you good old GUSA probably saved a ton going over the AZ. border as the regulations are so much "loser". I'd bet that Seeker and Calstar are probably on a first name basis with their AQMD inspectors.

Mark Griffin
[]
C&M Custom Tackle
San Dimas, California

Don't know what Ken is using but if I had a nice place I would go for the auto finishes. There paint even after a car accident still bends around the damage.They are making rubber fenders and door panels for them also. No more metal, just plastic and rubber.

Mark, that's WIERD!!!!!!

Mike

When I stopped doing body work they were thinking of water based paints. I think now most all are lacquer base coat with a polyurethane clear top coat.

I've never had any luck coming close to a factory finish when painting a blank myself- especially the clear topcoat (Permagloss, polyurethane, whatever). I always got runs lint etc.