The wraps on a rod I built about 2 months ago started to turn white. I used a blue thread on a black blank and applied 2 coats of CP prior to finishing with Flex Coat.

There is a white cloudiness/ somewhat of a shine, that appears to be in the epoxy. Any ideas what caused this? Is this merely cosmetic or will it cause the wraps to eventually degrade?

I dont believe I did anything different on this rod than the previous 3 I built, and they have no problems.

Thanks.

Gray,
Sounds like water under the wraps . Need to rewrap. Marcel

Is this discoloration permanent? Or does it seems to come and go?

Cured finish will sometimes blush like this on its surface in high humidity conditions. I don't know how many times I have seen these milky white opaque "stains" over finished areas of the rod covered in early morning dew, or light rain. Once it warms up and the moisture evaporates the discoloration goes away. I am certain it is moisture causing this, but cannot answer why or how.

I've tried waxing the rods, using armor all, furniture polish, etc to keep this from happening, but I seem to be able to only lessen it, not completely cure it. Whatever it is it appears it is harmless.

Lou

I suspect that the strength of the wrap will not be significantly diminished by this white-ish cloudiness. Water itself will not really effect the nylon thread's tensile strength. ... However, if it should ever turn black-ish, or if the blue thread color looks faded or bleached, then that indicates a chemical reaction has occured, probably after some kind of microbe found its way inside the wrap, and had enough water there to feed its growth. ... Then the microbes try to digest the nylon and eat it, and the waste products can bleach the color. The dark color is the microbial colonies growing. (Like jungle rot.)

The cause of this cloudiness may have been that the color preserver was not completely dry enough before you laid down your first coat of thread finish. If the brand of CP you use is water-compatible, then that may have been the source of the water. If this cloudiness does not involve water, but some other component of the CP solvent solution, then the cloudiness is likely to be more persistent.

It also sounds like the time you wrapped this rod was cold weather (Dec. 2005). ... I don't know what kind of heating / air conditioning system you have, (furnace or steam; central heat & air, etc.), but if your humidity in the rod room that day was higher and your temperature was colder than your usual conditions, then that could easily DOUBLE your drying time.

If you can live with the cloudiness in the wraps, you should not have any problems with microbial growth for a long time to come. No need to re-wrap for strength reasons on a normal duty rod. ...

If LQQKS matter, ... get out the razor. This cloudiness is likely to just keep coming back whenever the rod gets wet, and just keep going away after drying out for a few days. If you fish saltwater, do NOT not rinse the rod to prevent the wrap from going milky. Then your guides will suffer from corrosion faster than your threads degrade from getting wet. DO RINSE the rod with freshwater after use in saltwater, or wash it with soap after a slimy fishing trip. ...

Like Lou Reyna said, this cloudiness in the wraps is relatively harmless, just annoying. Catching more fish on this rod will cure the problem ! ... IMO, ... -Cliff Hall++, Chemist



Edited 3 time(s). Last edit at 03/11/2006 08:04AM by Cliff Hall.

It does sound like water " moisture " getting under the thread. Try putting the rod in a warm place for a day or two, or three. if it clears up, you can fix it by putting another coat of finish on the wraps. -- This time make sure the finish extends " onto " the blank on both sides and around the upright post that holds the ring on.
Your finish may only be to the wrap edge ? If so water is seeping under the thread.

Gary,
I have had a few rods do this in the past. They would get cloudy white on the surface when exposed to any moisture. In my case the cloudiness would clear up when the rod was dried out well but would appear again when exposed to moisture again. I think that it is due to the epoxy never completely curing. In my case I suspect that it was due to an improper mix of the epoxy to begin with because the epoxy also did not feel as hard and slick on the surface as it normally does.




Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 03/11/2006 11:27AM by Emory Harry.

If you do refinish make sure to scuff with a scothbrite pad to a water break free surface.

Freddwhy (Rapt-Ryte)

Thanks everybody. It's been two days and the whitening is still there. I'll give it a few more.

If it does go away, can I put FC light over the regular FC that I currently have on it, or should I stick to regular FC?

Regarding the scuffing, do you mean scuff the epoxy that is currently there prior to adding the new coat?

Thanks again.

Gary,
Yes, I am sure that is what Fred means. If the discoloration does NOT go away after the rod has had a chance to dry out well then I do not know what to tell you except do not put another coat of epoxy over the discoloration. It will just trap the discoloration under the new coat of epoxy. In fact, if this is the case you will probably have to cut the wraps off and rewraps the guides.
Either regular Flex Coat or the Flex Coat Lite will work but the Lite will probably be better because it will result in a little less build up of the epoxy.
If you try to dent the wraps with your finger nail does it dent and not feel slick and hard??
Let us know how you come out with this.

I just took my fingernail to the finish where it is white and it cracked and began to peel. I'll have to remove them and start over.

Think this was caused by moisture, or some other problem? I'm just trying to figure out what happend so I dont make the same mistake again. I still dont know what I did differently on this rod compared to the others.

Gary,
If it did not clear up after a few days and the wraps cracked under your fingernail the only thing that I can think of is that moisture got in under the wraps. If you used color preserver and did not extend the epoxy beyond the color preserver to seal it that could be the problem. The epoxy must be applied so that it completely covers the color preserver or moisture will get under the wraps. If that is the case then I think that you are going to have to cut the guides off and start over.

Thanks, I imagine that is the problem. I tried to make the finish less bulky and apparently went with too little finish. Time for the razor.

Thanks to all for your help.

I used to have this problem. I quit using flex coat and never had it again. Turn milky when wet or humid, be perfectly clear when the sun came out and dried a few hours later.

So I started taking the finish and thread off and am noticing that the two never really bonded. The finish is just peeling away from the thread. Maybe I used too much CP, as I used two rather thick coats. However, I did let it dry for a day or two before finishing.

So I've rewrapped two of the guides so far and when I go to put on the Gudebrod CP it is sort of thick and gel-like/glue-like. Reminds me of Dave's Flexament. It was like that last time as well, but it absorbs into the thread and appears to dry fine.

Perhaps I have a bad bottle? Or is this normal?

Gudebrod's 811 CP seems to vary quite a bit in it's "thickness" consistency from bottle to bottle. I know Ralph O'Quinn is gonna shoot me for this, but when I have a bottle that's really thick like that, I put several drops into a shot glass and thin it with a drop or two of alcohol. I use this for the first coating and then follow with one of full strength.

Ralph has said if it's that thick, just mix the whole bottle; get it to the consistency you can work with right off the bat...don't get it too thin, though...

Putter
Williston, ND