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SiC guides
Posted by:
steve parks
(65.214.202.---)
Date: November 03, 2005 05:53PM
What is the American Tackle and Pac Bay equivalent to the Fuji SiC Titanium frame guides?
Thanks, Steve Re: SiC guides
Posted by:
Cliff Hall
(---.dialup.ufl.edu)
Date: November 03, 2005 06:11PM
Guide Ring Materials Comparable to Silicon Carbide (SIC):
ATC: TITAN / NANOLITE PB: ___ / ___ (Ti-Ox: Titanium Oxide) VICKER'S HARDNESS SCALE: [www.batsonenterprises.com] Stainless Steel (SS): 200 Chrome: 800-1000 Aluminum Oxide: 1200-1400 Alconite: 1700 NANOLITE: 1800 (TITAN) [per Joe Meehan, American Tackle] Zirconia: 1800-2000 SiC: 2200- 2400 Re: SiC guides
Posted by:
Anonymous User
(Moderator)
Date: November 04, 2005 09:09AM
To my knowledge, no one other than Fuji and American Tackle makes frames from solid titanium alloy. Hoever there are many titanium coatings used on steel frames throughout the industry.
........ Re: SiC guides
Posted by:
Mark Gibson
(---.cpinternet.com)
Date: November 06, 2005 09:10AM
. Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 11/07/2005 11:45PM by Mark Gibson. Re: SiC guides
Posted by:
Cliff Hall
(---.dialup.ufl.edu)
Date: November 06, 2005 10:38AM
Mark Gibson - I don't mind at all having any information that I present being upgraded - or upbraided. I'd rather be corrected than propagate misinformation.
I had gleaned my information about a year ago from the Batson Enterprises website cited above, which I have not re-visited since. Nor did I do a Google Search and find some Vickers Hardness values from Engineering Journals. I too had thought it was suspiciously high in the Vickers Hardness scale, because I had found a MOHR Hardness scale which gave cubic Zirconium and Aluminum Oxide as having a relative hardness value of 7.5 verses 8.0 respectively. MOHR HARDNESS SCALE (sometimes spelled "Moh's"): Zircon, cubic - 7.5 Aluminum Oxide - 8.0 Silicon Carbide - 9.0 VICKER'S HARDNESS SCALE (per Batson Enterprises): Aluminum Oxide: 1200-1400 Alconite: 1700 NANOLITE: 1800 Zirconia: 1800-2000 SiC: 2200- 2400 I was trying to give the benefit of the doubt to the VH values at B.E., because I was assuming that a special fusion process could improve the crystal structure enough to raise the relative value of the zircon above the aluminun oxide. And I had thought that the fishing tackle industry should know more about the VH values for zircon on the guide ring than some engineering journal that only cares about zircon as a blasted abrasive for preparing bridges for re-painting. But clearly, Mark, as you are suggesting, that may be wishful thinking to say that Zircon is harder than ALOX. It may only be that the zircon makes a better substrate for PVD (Physical Vapor Deposition) because of its finer crystal structure, as you said. Maybe only AFTER the PVD is the zirconium surface harder than the ALOX surface to any realistic extent. Anyway, thanks, Mark Gibson, for your input. By the way, I was hoping you would send me your e-ddress. It is "Hidden" in your User Profile. I have been trying to do an analysis of the kinetic energy and frictional losses involved in casting, especially in spinning rods. I was hoping I could consult with you, and other trained mechanical engineers (M.E.), who know the right equations to use for such systems. As of now, by my current estimates, the magnitude of the frictional losses, even in the worst case scenario, seems to be less than 1% of the kinetic energy of the flying lure, and I wanted to make sure that I was not missing something dramatic. With all our discussions in rod-building on guide placement and the reduction of friction, it has been hard to acccount for all the controversy, if the proportional magnitude of these frictional losses is indeed as low as 1%. Your (plural) M.E. input would be greatly appreciated. ... Thanks for your consideration, Mark, and for your critical review of these Hardness values. -Cliff Hall, Gainesville, FL-USA+++ . E-ddress: cmkmhall@ufl.edu . Re: SiC guides
Posted by:
Mark Gibson
(---.cpinternet.com)
Date: November 06, 2005 11:41PM
. Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 11/07/2005 11:46PM by Mark Gibson. Re: SiC guides
Posted by:
steve parks
(65.214.202.---)
Date: November 07, 2005 11:15AM
I'm glad Tom posted his straight forward and simple post! LOL
The reason for my asking was that I have two rods to build and I wanted to use the Fuji SiC guides with Titanium frames. But Fuji doesn't make the tip top ring in a number 6. Not that could see anyway. I want my top to be the same size as my smallest guide. So, I was thinking I might could find what I was looking for from another manufacturer. Thanks, Steve Re: SiC guides
Posted by:
Cliff Hall
(---.dialup.ufl.edu)
Date: November 07, 2005 08:21PM
Steve Parks asked: "I wanted to use the Fuji SiC guides with Titanium frames. But Fuji doesn't make the tip top ring in a number 6. Not that could see anyway. I want my top to be the same size as my smallest guide. So, I was thinking I might could find what I was looking for from another manufacturer."
Now that you've narrowed and refined your question, Steve, it looks like FUJI DOES make a guide that fits your guide scheme: the TFST Mud-Hole Catalog 2005, page 59. FUJI "TITANIUM CONCEPT SIC TOPS" TFST-6MM-__/64ths inch Tube Size: $8.20 From the photograph in the Catalog, this Concept frame for the SiC ring does not seem to hold the ring off the tube quite as high as the Alconite-ring Concept-frame Tip-Tops. For Fuji's Titanium frame, Silicon Carbide Tip-Tops, the smallest rings for TPST (regular frame) or TLST (fly rod frame) are 8mm and 7mm, respectively. ... For exactly the kind of frustration you have experienced, Steve, I prefer to look thru a hard-copy Catalog than relying on only on-line website searches. How can you find something if you don't know on which webpage they put it? Concept? SiC? Titanium? ... Plus, I think the hard-copy Catalog search is much faster, and you don't have to re-boot, etc. I don't know if MudHole still has any 2005 Catalogs, or if the 2006 Catalog is ready yet, but it is worth the trouble to get your hands on one. IMO. FYI, -Cliff Hall+++ Re: SiC guides
Posted by:
steve parks
(---.mob.bellsouth.net)
Date: November 08, 2005 05:48AM
Thanks Cliff! See, it pays to pay a little more attention huh? LOL
Thanks, Steve Re: SiC guides
Posted by:
Cliff Hall
(---.dialup.ufl.edu)
Date: November 08, 2005 07:25AM
Steve - You're welcome. Hopefully, your Tip-Top's tube size TFST-6MM-__/6ths will be in-stock, (ordered) and arrive soon. ... Oh, and have Mud-Hole, or whoever you ever order from, send you a hard-copy CATALOG. (It's worth the ~$3 if a Supplier has to charge for it, to defray costs.)
IMO, It's easier than we think to have one question in mind, but ask another one - usually getting off us track. ... Kinda like a lot of my answers ! -LOL- The poor guy just wants 2 sentences: a short & direct answer. And I throw a 6-panel pamphlet at him. Good for the Posterity and the RBO Archives. But sometimes a little TMI ("Too Much Information!"), eh? -LOL-. I do that often because I think it helps to address the (closely) related issues on the subject, and have them all included in ONE, more comprehensive, Thread or Reply. Because the next Reader is waiting, with baited breath, to see what will be said about THEIR question on this same subject. Or waiting to see what other Posters will say about some corollary aspect of the subject. I hope that stimulating a more comprehensive response to Posts builds all our knowledge, and improves our critical thinking skills. ... I know it most definitely has mine. ... Best Wishes. Steve. -Cliff Hall, Gainesville, FL-USA+++ P.S.: TFST + M-H = Get the Catalog ! Re: SiC guides
Posted by:
Tony Dowson
(---.ok.shawcable.net)
Date: November 08, 2005 08:11AM
I sure wish the TLST was available in a size 6 ring.
A size 8 would be nice too,LOL. Sorry, only registered users may post in this forum.
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