I was just wondering how important it is to scuff the blank befor applying the reel seat and handle? I glued up my reel seat to the blank last night and I relized today that I never scuffed the black were teh seat was glued to. If anyone can get back to me with an answer it would be great. even though I know it is to late to do anything now but what problems can i expect in the future if any?
Thank you
Tyler

A water break free surface is necessary for proper adhesion.Depending on the type of rod and pressure with a fish on you may be ok.I have light duty rods that were not scuffed and the held up fine.

Freddwhy (Rapt-Ryte)

Please take a moment and read the article on proper surface preparation in the online library. It will tell you all you'll ever need to know on this subject pertaining to what we do when bonding rod parts.

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You'll likely be just fine Tyler.
A discernable "water break free" surface is only the OPTIMUM bonding surface and there are several ways to achieve this. Cleaning/scuffing is simply the best practice for a complete bond. You should try to remember this step of course but you can often get a good bond with no prep.

Josh Markvan
www.markvanheirloom.com

I was just wondering how important it is to scuff the blank befor applying the reel seat and handle?

It's for your peace of mind knowing that it won't fail. By not doing proper surface prep, you've let in the 'nagging doubt' syndrome. What if? Why didn't I ...

If oils from your hands were on the surface of the rod blank in the area of the adhesion, you could get some problems. All who handled that blank before gluing it...

That's the best reason I think of for doing it properly, Tyler. For my own peace of mind.

Putter

Because it takes so little time to prepare your surfaces, and because not doing any prep work only increases the risk that your bond will fail, I think it's unwise to overlook this very important step in the bonding process.

With no prep work, you may get a bond that is sufficient for the task at hand, but you won't get a good bond. Spend the extra two minutes and prep the parts properly.

On the rod you have now, you'll just have to cross your fingers and hope for the best. If it's intended for light duty use, you may never have a problem. But it something pops loose or twists on you, well.... it's possible. At least you'll know how to do things better on the next go around.

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Hey Tyler. I usually dont scuff up my blank. I just make sure it is clean. I have built over 20 rods without a problem yet. I use rodbond which has worked well. The builders above know what they are talking about more than i do. If they say to scuff the blank to so. I am just letting you know if you used a good bit of rod bond to a decently cleaned surface you should be fine.
Sincerely,
Dan Colville

That's not really true. Glossy surfaces do not allow the RodBond, or any other epoxy, to sufficiently "wet" the surface being bonded. You will have far less adhesion that you would have with a properly prepped surface. The amount of adhesive you use is really not at issue (as long as both surfaces are completely covered). I'm glad you haven't had any problems, but you're likely to run into trouble at some point down the line. I'd be the first to say that the stresses realized by the bonds on most fishing rods is not very great, but I'd caution about being too careless on your bonding surface prep work. In many, many years of doing repair work, one of the most common failures was on factory rods where no surface prep had been done and parts had shifted, slipped or twisted.

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How do you guys usually scuff your blanks? Do you just run a low grit sand paper on them and them clean?

I've started using the gray Scotchbrite pads. I get them at automotive paint stores (locally, Praxair). NAPA and other parts stores that sell automotive paint probably carry them, also. It's a 3M product and really works great for prepping surfaces.

Take a 1/4" rod and hacksaw a groove down the middle of it about an inch or so. Put a small piece of the Scotchbrite in that, chuck it in your drill, and clean the inside of that reel seat, too. Make double sure ALL surfaces are properly prepared.

Yeah, these are little things. But like Tom mentioned about the 'most frequent' cause of factory rod failures (which I have to second; I did many repairs on this same type failure); these are the LITTLE things that make a custom rod so superior to any that you can buy.

It's not the colors and the pretties; it's the little things like proper surface preparation that set these rods apart.

Putter
Williston, ND

I made the mistake of scuffing with sandpaper and made a few deep digs into the graphite weakening the blank. Today I use scotchhbrite found on the supermarket shelf next to the powder cleaners. It takes me less than 30 seconds to prepare the blank for a perfect epoxy bond. I have seen epoxy break away easily on smooth surfaces before, I would never apply epoxy on a smooth surface without some sanding.... Bob.

Hi, Bob.

Once that green pad (coarser) is worn a lot, it'll actually do a better job. You should really try these gray ones. It isn't the 'roughness' of the surface that gets a good adhesion, it's the water break-free part of it. The gray Scotchbrite is really the best choice for this. The surface 'feels' smooth when done, not like when I used to use sandpaper.

Just trying to help out; I'm still learning these things too!! ;)

Putter
Williston, ND

Tyler,

II would say that good surface prep is one of the most important things you’ll do in rod building…how important is it to you that the adhesive bond or thread finishes hold up? The wetting of a surface is related to both the chemistry and the viscosity of the material. If the bonding surfaces don’t “like” each other, then you’re going to have problems. That’s why a good clean, contaminate free surface on the blank is so important. Another aspect of wetting and getting a good bond is related to the viscosity or flowability of the adhesive. The higher the viscosity of the adhesive, the more attention you need to pay to some parts of your prep. You might actually be able to wet out a good smooth surface as long as it’s clean, but you’re giving up one other important component of adhesion…mechanical interlocking of the joining surfaces.

When you scuff the surface with something very fine, you’re doing a few things to promote the adhesion. One is that you’re cleaning it, second, you’re significantly increasing the surface area, and thirdly, you maximize the ability of higher viscosity adhesives to flow into the surface. A note of caution….. a very rough scratched surface won't have near the surface area of adhesion compared to one that's scuffed with a something finer like a Scotchbrite pad. A second, but more insidious effect is that some of these high viscosity epoxy resins won't be able to displace the air in the deep pits and may not fully wet a surface full of large scratches.....even something like 80-100 grit sandpaper can reduce the wet out and bond strength. Bottom line is that a finely scuffed surface will not only clean the surface, but will also give the maximum surface area for bonding as well as the best mechanical interlocking.


mark

You might also want to tape off any area that you DON'T want scuffed!!!! Accidents happen!!

Yeah, especially those areas where the exposed casting seats are glued up on...
Wish I could remember to do that EVERY time I glue one up!!

Putter
Williston, ND