There have been numerous posts on the subject of cork quality, grading, price and availibility on the board in the last few days. I do not think that any builders have knowlege of just how big of a cost item cork is to manufacturers. It has even gotten to the point where manufacturers are "faking" cork and marketing it to the buying public. I really consider some of the tactics being used as totally unscrupulous. There needs to be some way that we as builders could get involved in a manner that would stop this type of business practice. This Trade Group that Tom Kirkman has been promoting could certainly stop this type of activity if it so desired. The junk that is available from the large box retailers will eventually destroy the availability of quality stuff. I noticed in the paper yesterday that the only difference between China / Korea and Wallmart is that the former two had armies with guns and tanks! The importers bringing this type of stuff into the country should be stopped NOW!

I am posting a picture of simulated cork on the Photo board and would wonder just what Grade will be assigned to it by the manufactures? The sample in the picture was removed from an imported rod that was sold as a "Falcon" to a bass fisherman who was motivated by the name on the rod and the price.

Gon Fishn

Only those compaines that actually joined a trade group would ever be bound by its regulations, and only then if it decided to even create such regulations. Most of the companies involved in the manufacture of fishing rods are already members of a trade group, the ASA (American Sportsfishing Association) and I doubt they're going to try and regulate their member's advertising.

So... custom rod builders have another point on which to educate their own customers and potential customers. It's not all bad. The worse their rods are, the better ours become. But I do agree, the type marketing and advertising done by those who can afford it is powerful "medicine" to the sportsfishing masses.

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The only thing that will have any effect is our dollars (low demand = low prices). I pretty much quit buying regular cork sometime ago. Wood, Burl, Flocking and Andy's great exotics are my choice (and more and more builders are making the switch) Once you get by being bound by "tradition" you will find these materials more durable, consistant and, dare I say, pleasing to the eye.

Before you jump on me over weight, split grips or better yet, Tom K's suggestion to drill them out and slide a Flex Coat insert into them will take care of that issue.

Mike



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 07/26/2005 08:07PM by Mike Barkley.

On the AOL Sign On Board a message just appeared for Bass Pro - Check out our fantastic fall specials - IM7 Bassing Pro Casting Rods with Fuji Aluminum Oxide Guides and quality cork over twenty models for all techniques $ 19.99. If comodities have price floors to support farmers why can not fishing equipment do the same when the taxing of the fishing items pays a substantial share of taxes to things like maintaining shoreline and sales taxes to the various tax districts that the large box stores are located in. The sales tax on a $ 19.95 rod will not pay for a teacher salary increase. Baton Rouge just passed a law that allows Bass Pro and Cabellas to apply all collected sales taxes to the bonds to acquire the land and the note on their buildings. Esentially our tax money will build a store to allow them to sell imported stuff.

Gon Fishn

I'm in the same camp with Mike regarding regular cork.

I enjoy glueing up cork sheets into the required thicknesses, using Andy's products, as well as rubberized cork & gasket material from auto supply stores to make fore & rear grips.

Some interesting and durable grips can be fashioned from the most iconoclastic materials.

Stan

I just found a place online that sell glow-in-the-dark safety grip tap in a variety of styles.....Combined with the glow in dark paint I am working on the resulting rod has night fishing for cats all over it....Would be fun for practical...well maybe not so practical....jokes.

Look....Its the phantom fishing rod!

Derek

Never thought of using cork sheets.....Hmmmmm

Have been building my own rods now for the past couple of years, my son has watched me and has also built his own rod, he noticed on an older store rod the fake cork handle is starting to peel of the grip. This cork like sheet is desinged to look just like cork rings to the everyday fisherperson with no knowledge of rod building. In the eyes of a rod builder you may be able to notice that it is a sheet of cork wrapped around a foam handle.

That is why I prefer to build my own and have the satisfaction of knowing it is a quality built rod that will yield many years of fishing.


Fernando Torres

This is an interesting discussion. It reminds me of the fact that most furniture today is made from MDF and then covered with wood veneer (well, some isn't even covered with veneer - it's painted with a process that makes the surface look like wood grain. A customer of mine developed the better process for this many years ago. He's quite well off because of it.)

In the end, which is the better piece of furniture - that made from solid wood which can, sometimes, warp, crack, split or check? Or that made from stable MDF and then covered with a nice wood veneer for a very pleasing appearance?

I'm not taking up for any rod manufacturer that might be using these new grips in order to mislead anyone into thinking that they're getting a solid cork grip. But we might want to look at this in a totally objective fashion. In the hands of a custom builder, maybe a similar process would allow for a better appearing, lighter grip. High quality cork veneer over a urethane foam core for the best in rigidity, weight and appearance?


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I think the whole thing is 90% of fisherman go into a store or on line and see what is being sold for $40.00???

So when we can not build the same thing for that price --- what do we do --cheat???
Go to a site - even here and check out rods?? Now collect the parts ? Try to build it for that price??
Yea I know they can be built better,
Seems people do not care!! They want PRICE

I have to agree and simpathize Bill B. I don't think I will ever get into the business of trying to sell rods for just that reason. In these financial times, people like me, have to go for minimum possible price for what will work. THe butt sections are often too long or too short, there are almost NEVER enough guides, or they are not properly places, and the wraps on the guides are often horrible and even more full of crossovers abd gaps than mine.

I look at the rods sold at Big 5, Sportsmart, and other with a careful eye and realize that maybe my wraps are not that bad after all.

The price of good components can be prohibitive as well. We know what SHOULD be used to build a rod, you can describe in detail the reasons to a customer and even show him a detailed invoice, and he will still try to talk you down in your labor costs.

My response to such things in my photography business is simple. You are trying to buy art for a stick figure price.....Maybe you can buy some throw away cameras and be happy, but a cheap price cheapens the memories.

I agree...Interesting thread.

Derek

What about not using the top grade ultra-clear and even cork, and instead working with the second tier stuff in an interesting and artistic way?

I made a walnut and cherry blanket chest for my wife and the carefully aligned and glued top has both some sapwood and a large knot in it. No, this does not look like grade-A walnut, but all grade-A walnut looks like to me anymore is walnut veneer glued to MDF. Sad but true. I like it with the flaws and the knot and the interesting coloring... it looks like it was made by a person and not mass-manufactured for sale at Walmart.

As all of those $19.99 rods SEEMINGLY are made of flawless top grade cork, maybe it's time for those who produce things with care in their basement shop to go another way with it... otherwise, fishing at the bank, how does your rod look any different than the guy with the factory rod 20 paces down without a very close look?

Why would any custom rod builder want to compete with any major department store. I say go buy one of these rods cut the grip down the middle,so you can see what it is made of,find the worst one in the store.

Then when someone asks you why they should pay for a custom rod show them.

Show them the unfilled tunnels on the guides that weren't ground. The painted on trim "wraps". The poor components.

Then tell them how "yes I can make this rod to match your boat/school colors/wife's eyes/or whatever, and yes you can have whatever components you want"

Use the situation to your benefit