OK I just had a talk with a customer that had some surf rods built by other " champion casters " ?

My question is this:
Is every rod basically built the same. I mean depending on guide sizes, color, ring material, how it is used casting, boat, trolling,

You take the flex of the blank, place guides acording to how long it is, maybe one or two more, static test, for even stress on the blank. A tuna stick may need less Bla, bla.
Reel used trolling cast fly.

How can things change that much from an ultra light to a surf?????? Of course one is longer

Says he loves the one I built his son, and he even uses it

I mean this guy should have just stuck a knife in me
Thanks for letting me vent



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 07/12/2005 10:10AM by bill boettcher.

Don't take it personal, it's business. The customer is not always right but he is always the customer. Jesse

Hmmm, I couldn't figure out from your post what your customer's actual complaint was....

As an admitted beginner I am learning the inescapable fact that the practice can be divided into two distinct areas. The first, and by far the more pleasant to focus on, is the actual craft of planning and constructing the rods themselves. All the skills, science and inventiveness rod builders strive to incorporate into their latest efforts is what keeps rod crafters passions alive and growing. The other side of the equation comes in when we offer our creations to the publeic; shether for sale or as gifts. Here we are subject to all levels of personal preferences and beliefs covering the full scope of possibility frim the greatest experience to the least informed yet highly defended beliefs about what is right and preferred. It seems to me the only way the gap between factual information and strongly held, but less than accurate, opinions can only be conquered though consistent education of the market[placve through evry avenue available to us as builders. I cannot find a more exemplary effort in this effort than RodMakier Magazine and this very web site. But for all the good effrots of Tom Kirkman and those who contribute to raising the standard of excellent information offered in these two outlets is not enough to overturn the vast weight of misinformation that is deeply embedded in the fabric of the fishing community around the world.

I would like to think that the inroads made and esposed here have encouraged the major rod manufacturers to incorporate the proven science into their advertising and marketing campaigns. Personally I believe that those who do will gan the trust of a public which has become increasingly aware of the previous confusing and inconcsistent explainations whchi were motivated by winning customers by careful manipulations of human nature3 as opposed to serious efforts of establishihng or adhering to valid comparisons.

The publication of Dr. Hanniman's Common Cents System marked a major advance toward shifting the priority toward solid information. The science is clear. The system works. But the marketplace will only embrace what will boost thier bottom line. This is not an indictment but rather a fact which has to be taken intpo account.

The spending habits of fishermen is not linear. Just because a rod can be proven t o perform better does not mean that every fisherman is going to be willing to change his buying habits. Custom rod builders market to a small fraction of the overall buying public. Major manufacturers have entirely different business concerns. It is unlikely they will ever deem it in their best interest to adopt the same principles of rod construction and performance. This may not be a bad thing for thsoe of us who are dedicated to crafting fine fishing instruments.

If the big booys were able to create rods as good as the finer custom builders and market them at prices that no individual could match where would that leave the custom rod building community?

I do not blindly follow the rule that the customer is always right. I do not want a customer who does not appreciate the concerns I place in my work. I only want customers who are right for me and my work. Let the others enjoy the selections they make from among the millions of choices available to them. I am not pleased when misinformation is being propogated. I am often quick to debunk it when I dsee it. This is one way we all can contribute to the educatiion of the public. But I do not need to see the commercial market colmpletely embrace the higher standards of excellent information for me to trust in the superiority of these advancements.

Again, I seriously doubt custom rod building could remain a viable small business for even the few who have carved their niche if it were not for the unwilingness and/or inablility for the major players to create the same product at competitive prices.

Perhaps making a comparison to the jewelry market might make the point better. The market for reasonable priced diamond engagement rings flourishes across a very broad range of price and quality. This in no way hinders the high end market for those who want the prestige of something unique and can afford the price. Harry Winston, Cartier's, Bulgari and the other high end jewelers are not losing sales not sleep due to the millions of diamond rings sold in Wallymart. Neither should we.

My goal is to raise my skills to the highest level I can and then find the niche market of those who will be happy to pay the prices I deem fair for this work. The priority for me is to enjoy the entire process as much as possible.
It is not about making the most money possible but living the life I want. We are free to choose our own priorities. God bless America.

Dave

Dave Gilberg Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> My goal is to raise my skills to the highest level
> I can and then find the niche market of those who
> will be happy to pay the prices I deem fair for
> this work. The priority for me is to enjoy the
> entire process as much as possible.
> It is not about making the most money possible but
> living the life I want. We are free to choose our
> own priorities. God bless America.
>
> Dave



*applauds*

Rob

That's what got me upset. maybe the fact that I did not tell him a whole lot of Hype.
Guess he would have rather trusted a guy with a Name as a Champion Caster ???

The bottom line is we're attaching pre-made parts to pre-made rod blanks, using techniques refined over many years. Epoxies have changed, guide materials have changed, some other materials have changed, but to the typical angler this and the number or placement of guides, as long as they are reasonably close to functionally correct in number and placement, will make little difference.

I seriously doubt he/she would be able to tell whether the Common Cents system was used, what kind of arbors are under the reels seat, or for that matter what kind epoxies were used. I agree with the previous poster, a rod builder is free to build a rod as he or she wishes, let the customer decide whether the end result is good or not.

I agree with Jesse Buky, let the customer decide what he wants. Personally I do not think this is propagating misinformation, this is providing the angler what he wants. Of course you are there to keep things in perspective.

Personally I think this whole rod building process gets blown out of proportion, made way too complicated. I definitely do not think rod building has any bearing in making my life "fuller" or more happy. If fact I sometimes dislike doing it.

O.k., let me get back to this pole I am building. I need to finish wrapping the eyes on it, so that I can put the glass on it.

Lou

Dang, an honest rod builder?? Lou, you shouldn't have!!

Putter
Williston, ND

Good point Lou
Guess a lot of people just like to buy the bells and whistles attached to a " Name Brand " with the large price tag

There is nothing like dealing with the public. Back in the mid 90's I had a lady call me from up state Va. to order a Fly rod for her husband as she had seen one of my rods there in her office and liked my work. I got all the info from her and went all out, Loomis blank etc. and I put single foot guides on it, at that time the cutting edge and not well known at all. Now here she is going all out to please her husband and he goes off the deep end when he see's the rod and writes me a letter telling me what a good fly fisherman he is and that the rod was not functional and unacceptable to his standards and he wanted to return it and get "HIS" money back. He sent me several pages out of catlogs showing many different fly rods and all of them had snake guides so anything else was unacceptable in his mind, was he an addvertiser's dream or what ? I got the rod back and sent "HER" money to her. That guy has to be in the top 10 dumbest husbands in the world, can you imagine how he just destroyed her confidence. It will be a cold day in @#$%& before she gives him another rod or anything else I hope. Jesse

I've met a few who definately put the Cuss in customer then, the many good people. Ralph

If at first you don't succeed, go fishing, then try, try again.

Jesse your right about dealing with the public.

Ralph Think I'll go fishin