I've been looking at a few used factory rods as of late and I can't help but notice the guide feet cracking the epoxy at the foot and base of each guide. Lack of flex in the epoxy is causing it, along with maybe too little finish.

Now.....I continue to read here about how little and how THIN rodbuilders like to make their epoxy over the wrappings. Why? Are looks more important than function? Shouldn't we put function first and apply enough epoxy to last years?

I can understand the rod makers trying to save every penny by using less finish on wrappings, but should we?

I also seen a rod that was "taking on water" under the fatory butt wrap and EVERY guide-raining all day. I don't want to "bash" the maker, but lets just say it was a $150+ factory rod by one of the big two. The rod wasn't that old at ALL, or overly used. You could litterly peal off the buttwrap epoxy almost like it were masking tape.

When is less epoxy bad, or good-pros and cons of each finish, thick or thin?

DR

less finish = less weight = better performance.
The finish dont crack that easy if the guidefeets are properly prepared.
The cracking has more to do with the fact that the rodblank bends and the guidefoot dont.
Thanks
-Kim-

Dr, Cracking can be caused by a number of conditions. Thinly-applied finish is normally not one of them. Cracking is typically caused by poor guide foot preparation, at least in my experience.
The suppleness of finish does not change relative to the thickness, therefore it makes no difference how thick or thin a finish is in relation to flexing.

Patrick Vernacchio



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 07/09/2005 02:45AM by Patrick Vernacchio.

One thing, the epoxy doesn't do anything but cover up the thread to protect it. As long as there is enough epoxy on there should not be any problems with water getting in. As for the cracking around the guides, preparing them correctly will make all the difference and make sure your thread tension is good. Knew of one person that had problems because his thread was loose and he thought the epoxy would hold everything in place. It is the thread that holds the guide securely in place, the epoxy just protects the thread.

That cracking is not caused by lack of flex in the epoxy, it's caused by the fact that metal guide feet and graphite or glass rod blanks flex at different rates. They aren't going to move together when flexed - something has to give. This is why it's important to grind or file the guide foot end to a very shallow taper - to make it more flexible.

Generally, commercially made rods have far too much epoxy on the wraps. They glob it on and set it to spinning and move on to the next rod. They can't afford to spend much time on each wrap or each rod.

It's not so much about how much epoxy you apply, but where you apply it. At least if you want to seal out the elements.

....................

Like Tom says they don't have much time. I would think the guides are not preped well either.

Interesting.

This cracking happened on both ends of the guide feet on spinning gear on two rods I seen. Looks like the guide feet were too ridgid and didn't bend with the blank, so what you have is cracking at the TIP of the guide foot and at the back of the guide foot where you want epoxy to get under the wrappings.

I can see by looking at these rods, where a thin bendable titanium guide foot would be of use, or thinning the guide foot down thin enough to bend with the rod and prevent the cracking.

Moisture under guide feet is not a bad thing with water getting under it?......seems to me it destroys the epoxy over time and the evidence was substancial. Or are you saying putting "enough" on will/should have sealed out the water and that would have prevented the problem-that I agree on.

Many factory rodmakers are bringing the finish TO the ends of the wraps and NO more, I think that is where the failure is starting.

DR

Onvce teh epoxy cracks, the guide will start to discolor/rust. Who gives a crap about teh epoxy? I should add I fish 99% Saltwater.

Guide technology has not kept pace with rod blank technology. Metal framed guides should have been obsolete long ago.

It's important to carry the epoxy just past the edge of the guide wraps to seal them as well as possible. Once a deep crack develops in the skin of the finish over the foot, the guide will eventually begin to rust. This is much more severe in saltwater use.

....

Regardless of the hows and whys? Would not an additional coat of epoxy
to the effected areas fix the problem at least for a while?

Raymond Adams
Eventually, all things merge, and a river runs through it..

No, the epoxy cracked for a reason - putting another coat on will temporarily cover teh crack, but not fix the cause for it cracking in the first place.

I found on my rods, some of the guides which cracked the quickest were those with inlays in the overwrap, right up the ramp of the guide. My guess is the change in tension between the main thread, and the inlay do not securely hold the guide in place.

I outwrap for several rod makers and one of the big ones, I won't mention who, doesn't grind any guides with a ring size 8 or lower. They don't grind any recoil guides of any size. I ended up grinding the guides that I did for them, but other outwrappers just wrap them as they are.

Perhaps that's why the epoxy cracks ??