Hey guys, despite building a hand-full of rods, I'm still not sure how far ahead of the reel seat the first guide should be. I always eyeballed it, guessed, and/or placed it in a spot that seemed okay. Now, with a rod in a static distribution stress test, I cannot seem to figure where to start the first guide. The blank is long one that I cut down (butt and tip), with there remaining a little bit of flex into the butt section. That may be what's messing me up. Help!!!
Scott

Scott,

I use the rule of 21 to 27 inches from the middle of the reel seat to the stripper guide but have had rods back 19" due to reel being used. I try and shoot for 24" as that will give you a little room for some fancy wraps, weave or inscription, ect.

Hank
On The Rocks Fishing
Wells, ME.

Thanks, Hank, but I think I just broke the rules. The first guide started at 18 inches from the center of the reel and the second guide was at 29 inches. After inserting the bumper guide in between, the line made sharp bends between them to the reel. I backed the first guide to 15 inches from the center of the reel and the second to 30 inches. Basically, this reduced the sharp angles between these guides and the bumper. It looks good unloaded. I'll load it again and see what it looks like. It's going to be a beauty of cod jigger.
Looking back at notes, other cod rods had stripper guides between 18 and 21 inches from the center of the seat. With slower taper (that I artificially created...I think), I wonder if having the first guide too far away would cause the line to hit my finger/hand on the foregrip with a big fish (or in my case a big snag). I'll leave it to you sharp guys to answer this question. Scott G

Scott,
The positioning of the first guide is always a judgement call. With a conventionally wrapped rod that is going to be used to cast with I think that you want as straight a line path from the reel to the tip as possible. I think that the best way to start off with the positioning of the first guide is to test cast the rod with the guides just temporarily attached and watch for a standing wave in the line between the reel and the first guide. A large standing wave tells you that there is a lot of friction and therefore losses at the first guide. With a spiral wrapped rod I think that the same principal applys, you want as straight a line path as possible to get the most efficient casting rod. However, with a spiral wrapped rod the second guide will be lower than with a conventionally wrapped rod so you will be able to get a relatively straight line path with a first guide that is closer to the reel. Again I would temporarilly position the guides and then test cast the rod and watch for line flow that is as smooth and with as small a standing wave in the line as possible.
You could start off with the guides set up just as they would be with a conventionally wrapped rod, using the static method of positioning the guides, and then just insert the bumper guide between the first and second guide and rotate the remaining guides 180 degrees as was described in the latest Rodmaker article but I think that you will find that this results in the first guide being a little too far from the reel to give you the optimum, straightest, line flow through the first guide.

Scott,

I'm sorry I did not relize that you were doing the bumper guide wrap I thought you were doing the Spiral wrap. I have no comment or info on the bumper wrap syetem.

Hank
On The Rocks Fishing
Wells, ME.

Thanks, guys. I fiddled a bit more with the guide placement and just attempted to get a straight line from the reel to the 180-degree guide (i.e. throught the 1st guide and the bumper guide). I found it impossible to get a straight line like that found when I use the O'Quinn method. The line still "zig-zags" a little bit through these guides. If I bias the first guide about 20 degrees and the second guide to 160 (with bumper in the middle), then I get a straighter line Would this now be called the "O'Gillman" spiral? Just kidding... I'll tape the guides and test cast this morning.

Well, it wouldn't be the Bumper Spiral. But it would be something else and might work fine.

Have you ever set up a casting rod in the conventional fashion with all the guides up top? If so, just put the butt guide in the same location that you when doing that. The ease of setting up the Bumper Spiral is because you don't change the location of they guides along the blank from where they would be if you were just doing a conventional guides-on-top rod. And you would not offset the butt guide. Just keep it right up on top where you would normally put it.

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Tom,
Does this mean I can't get my name on a guide wrapping technique? Darn! I understand your point about the ease of the bumper style in that you only have to flip down all but the first guide. I guess I already did that and still ended up with the first guide pretty close to the reel seat (15 inches). I was out in the street casting about 12 oz's of metal and varying the placement of the first guide while keeping the bumper guide half-way between guide 1 and 2. I never moved guide 2. I couldn't tell the difference in casting ease or distance. In fact, if anything, moving the guide farther away, to about 19 inches from the center of the reel seat, felt just as smooth, despite the more obvious zig-zag of line through the guides. I didn't notice much difference in the "standing wave" of line in either case. In fact, I think that it appeared more smooth when the first guide was pushed closer to the second, even with the sharper angles. Maybe it may not matter where I place these guides. Please correct me if I'm wrong (before I epoxy these things).
Thanks,
Scott

I would do my test casting before I flipped the guides over. Get the butt guide right while everything is still in conventional guides-on-top set up. Once you locate that one, space the rest, static test it again, flip them and add the Bumper guide.

The butt guide location on any casting rod is going to depend alot on the size and width of you reel and the flex of the rod in the butt area. You do not want the line to be able to get down on the foregrip or your hand under heavy low. So that means put it closer or use a higher guide. But, you don't want it so close that with the use of a wider reel the line has to come in at too steep of angle. I've found that most of my bass casting rods have #12 or #16 butt guides located at about 18 to 23 inches from the center of the reel seat. 15 inches is probably okay, but I think I would be tempted to push it out, just a bit farther.


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THanks, TOm. I'll keep the guide around 18-19 inches up. The rod loads fine and the line doesn't touch my hand or fingers. It seems to cast well. Now all I need is a big fat ol' codfish (if those commercial guys left me any).