i'm interested in using burl cork for a fly grip. the interest was piqued by seeing pac bay's new bamboo burl cork grips. unfortunately, they do not offer one in cigar so i might have to begin assembling a lathe setup sometime, sooner than i had anticipated.

on another web site, the subject of burl cork came up. not knowing much about it, i was wondering if the well-informed here could fill me in a bit about burl cork. i've gathered burl wood, for inserts, is obtained from an actual burl of wood, a naturally ocurring event which twists the wood into unusual shapes and patterns (correct me if i'm wrong).

how is burl cork created? is it man made, natural or can be either? since cork is a tree, i can imagine it MIGHT be a natural event which creates it, but i simply do not know. i've seen some burl cork (rings) that look very man made, even touted as rubberized and yet pacbay's bamboo burl cork looks much more natural. i've seen the rings that are offered in different colors. this stuff really looks like it was assembled from chips of cork like particle board. how does burl cork, in any form, wear? is it more susceptible to chipping than normal cork through use?

is filler used as much, less or even more than what might be considered "normal" cork grips? i imagine the burl, whichever style (if there are several) weighs more. i also imagine the weight, though probably noticeable, doesn't detract much since it is located at a fulcrum of sorts where the hand holds the rod.

and has anybody found burl cork, in preformed grips or rings, which i might be interested in, considering the pac bay stuff is attractive to me right now ( know i know, if i like it, why not stick with pacbay? they do not offer cigar yet and right now, i'm ready to work with preformed grips). tom has a burl cork grip on the photo pages which looks really nice but i gather it's not manufactured any longer.

so many questions, sorry about that ;-) thanks for any help or tips anyone can offer.


eric
fresno, ca.



Edited 3 time(s). Last edit at 01/10/2005 01:07PM by eric zamora.

Eric,
All Burl Cork materials are variations on a theme. They are usually a granulated cork material mixed with some type of "binding agent" to hold it together. With traditional Burl Cork the binding agent is visible (the black rubber type matrix that gives the grain some character). Traditional Burl Cork unfortuantely suffers from the same problem as regular cork in that there is some...often significant variation in the quality and grain from batch to batch. I am not familiar with PacBays Bamboo Burl Cork, however I can give you some specific facts in regards to the Exotic Burl Cork that I manufacture and sell. With the Exotic Burl Cork the binding agent is invisible which makes for a different look than traditional Burl Cork. Exotic Burl comes in several distinct grains/patterns which makes for unlimited possibilitie for mixing and matching rings within grips. Exotic Burl was specifically engineered ro accept a topcoat of finish, whether it's wax, urethane or oil.
There has been some talk recently of all types of Burl Cork weighing more than traditional cork, however this should be of little concern as there are many ways to 1: still keep overall rod weight down using the various burl materials and 2. Use the weight to your advantage to balance a tip heavy rod. Exotic Burl is 100% consistent from batch to batch as well, with no variation in quality
I sell Exotic Burl in 2 patterns (soon to be three patterns) in various ring size configurations. We are also looking into the possibility of offering preformed grips out of this material as well.

You can take a look at [www.lamarreelseats.com]

If you have any questions, please let me know.

Regards,

Andy Dear
Lamar Manf.

210-865-3256

andy... thanks for the reply. so burl cork is not like burl wood. sigh. ok, let's go from there ;-)

i love your new cork by the way. your offering is probably the main reason i've escalated my thoughts about moving into the creation of grips, away from preformed. but i'm just not ready yet. if you offer preformed sometime soon, that would be great.

a few points for clarification:

you write "granulated cork material mixed with some type of "binding agent" to hold it together." then you mention "traditional burl cork." is this one and the same? or the first is the latest method, and differs from traditional? by the way, i think it's the variation, at least in pattern, which is attractive in burl cork. variations in quality, now that is another thing altogether... if we're talking about structural quality.

i'm looking forward to seeing your third offering in exotic burl. i've seen the burnt cork examples under the heading "exotic burl cork" at your site. are these one and the same? i recall seeing some questions regarding that point. perhaps you might consider rewording the titles to clarify a bit more for visitors to your site.


best regards, and probably a customer soon if you don't mind,



eric
fresno, ca.

Eric,
ALl Burl Cork that I have seen including mine is granualted cork held together with a binding agent. Now different factories use different binding agents, and have different processes to get color and grain variations.
When I say "Traditional Burl Cork" I mean the stuff that has been on the market for many years, which is pretty much the same. And yes it varies in quality in terms of how well the granuals are packed...in other words density!


Do I mind if your a customer...NO! Please feel free to call me antytime, and let me know if I can help!


Andy Dear
Lamar Manf.

Eric,
I posted part of a handle assembly on the photo page. The handle is made with burl cork and one of Andy's wooden inserts. The rings were glued using Weldbond Universal Adhesive. Since burl is tougher, I prefer it over cork. There are no pits to fill and holds up really well. I have not tried Andy's exotic burl but that should a project for my next fly rod.
Cheers, Ellis

on another web site, which i referenced earlier in this thread, someone pointed out a paragraph from golden witch's site which warns aginst using burl cork for an entire handle since it is prone to chipping at the ends, recommending i think to use burl as accent pieces more than anything else. any comments? :-)

eric
fresno, ca.

Eric,

For peformed grips have you considered stain? I emailed you a couple pictures of stained grips.

bob.. YES, gazing into my crystal ball.. i see stained cork grips in my future! can't wait to try it out. burl cork, stained cork, rattan-wrapped cork, cork grip building, etc.. it's ALL there babybee, all in my future... ;-)

actually, i have yet to receive your pics bob. but i did see the examples of stained grips on the photo section a month or so ago. looks very promising.


eric

Eric,

I use Burl cork because of it's look, consistant quality (NO pits) and durability. I have done quite a few full grips and would definately recommend it to anyone (especially considering the quality of regular cork these days) If I buy 50 burl rings, I get to use 50 rings! I usuakky use foam or wood trim inserts and finish with Tru Oil. to really intensify the grain.

Can't wait to give Andy's stuff a try.

Mike

I just finished my first burl cork handle. A large one on a bottom fishing rod. burl cork is quit a bit heavier than regular cork. It also feels a little harder when you grip it. It works wonderfully. You can even turn it with a cutting tool on the lathe. I was worried about it chipping so I used a ring of regular cork at both ends of the grip and foregrip. After working this handle down I don't really think that was necessary. The other thing about burl cork is it is pretty cheap. I will definitely be using it some more, but not on lightweight fly rods.

Just curious! Has anyone weighed Burl and Reagular cork? I'd be interested in knowing what the weights are

Mike

Eric,

I have used burl cork on my custom rods for the past six years, and I love the look that the burl cork gives to my rod work.

I make custom shape burl cork grips and standard shape grips with wood caps. The wood I use is usualy buckeye burl, black ash burl, burl rose wood, cocobolo, walnut, and burl maple.

I offer my grips for sale, and they are offered as options on JP Ross Fly Rods.

You can look at my grips on my web site at: www.handcraftedcustomflyrods.com

If you are interested in one email and let me know.

Ryan

Eric,
If you want to turn your own burl handle your more than welcome to come up the hill and use my mandrels and lath.

thanks dennis. i might just take you up on that someday before the season begins.

eric
just down the hill from dennis...