Hi all! I've spent several weeks lurking here and reading about rod building and finally I've taken the plunge. For my first rod I thought I would build something for stripers up on the North Shore (north of Boston). I ended up going with a Hook & Hackle IM6 (really nice dark green blank) 9' 4 piece 8wt. So now of course the questions start coming!

Question 1: I've looked through the FAQs, posts and Library here and other sites and can not find guide locations for this blank. I have 2 stripping guides and 8 double foot snake guides. The closest location chart I could find is a 9' 4 piece 5 wt on another site.

I plan to wrap in 2 colors - primary is dark green with a spring green accent wrap. I practiced wrapping on some old carbon fiber tube that i use for my RC helicopter and airplane hobby so I think I have the wrapping under control.

Probably the next question will be on spline location. From the reading I've done, it seems that it is more difficult as the # of rod segments increases - so of course I had to choose a 4 piece rod as my first!

Thanks in advance!
Michael

Read the Faq's page and the Library page up in the black section. This has good info on guide placement and finding the spine - Welcome

Thanks Bill. I have read those pages. I was hoping to find something a little more definative!

cheers,
Michael

A lot of the sponcers on this page have charts. I usually go to St Croix's site and start with there spacings. Remember this is only a " starting point " and the static test will tell you where the guides should be. On light rods I usually start the first guide from the tip at 4" then add an inch as I go down the blank. Just to start

Tom Kirkman's book, Rod Building Guide, would have the answers to most of your questions.

We're not avoiding your questions here but they're so general and so basic that you appear to need to some good starter info first and that book or one of the others would be a good place to start.

There are no guide "locations" for that or any blank. You find those by static distribution. Learn to do it right on the first one and you'll find the rest a breeze in the future.

thanks William. I actually do have Garcia's book "Handcrafting a Graphite Fly Rod" but it doesn't have much info on placement on 4 piece blanks. I think that is my only hangup. I reread the static placement document in the library and a spreadsheet calculator - so I'll use that as a starting point and do the static placement.

In thinking about it, that does make the most sense - I wanted a custom rod after all!

thanks,
Michael

I'm no fly rod fisherman, but are you sure you don't want to try ceramic ring guides on such a heavy weight fly rod? If you SEARCH = RING + SNAKE, you can access some opinions from those who live & breath that stuff. - Just my sidelines opinion, -Cliff Hall .

8. Re: fly rod snake guides or single foot guides??? Andrew White 10-22-04
I was skeptical at first, building my first few fly rods with single foot wire guides. Then, I tried the ceramic single foot guides, and I haven't gone back. Even the relatively inexpensive Alconite

9. Re: fly rod snake guides or single foot guides??? Bill Moschler 10-22-04
Single foot ceramics for me. Everytime I fish my rods with snakes after about 30 min I start wondering why I brought that one. In many subtle ways the ceramics just make fishing a little easier.

11. Re: fly rod snake guides or single foot guides??? Tom Kirkman 10-21-04
I use only ceramic guides and determine the number of feet by what kind of use the rod will see. As far as what looks "right," I don't think you can object to single footed guides and not

15. Re: The Best Guides For Saltwater Bret Rahe 10-14-04
I would forget the snakes and go with Fuji Titanium alloy frames with either SiC or Gold Cermet rings. Ti alloy will be the most corrosion resistant.

21. Re: rings Bryan Ion 09-24-04 -Thanks for the reply , I was taught to build using snakes but a couple of my loomis rods have single leg rings and my sages have snakes so I wasnt sure which way to go ,but thanks to you guys a Forum: rodboard

22. Re: rings Tom Kirkman 09-24-04 -- You can do a search on this site and turn up tons of information on that very subject. I would not put a snake guide on a fly rod, opting instead to use only ceramics for the past 25 years ....

23. rings Bryan M Ion 09-24-04 -- Hi I am in the process of building a 9ft #6 glx and wondering what other rodbuilders views were of snake rings against the single leg rings, Bryan

31. Re: Ceramic strippers and tip for 8wt fly Doug Weber 08-16-04 -- Ryan: Glad to see that you are planning to use ceramic ring guides for your 8 weight instead of snakes. You will like the way that they cast.

Mike: Guide placement is an interesting drill. Some folks take a scientific approach (there's a formula... mathematical progression.... like fret placement on a fretted instrument); others adopt the less- scientific LRTM formula ("looks right to me"). There must be a dozen guide placement charts on the net, and they vary widely re. placement and guide sizing. Some of the rod building books also provide charts. Be forewarned: some of these charts give little consideration to the number of blank sections, so lay out work is important (taping or temporarily gluing the guides to the blank to make sure the spacing protocol won't place a guide on a ferrule joint.) The reason no one can provide more definitive guidance is because there isn't any. There are general guidelines but no absolute rules. Even if you use the Dale Clemens formula, you may have to make some adjustments. (Buy the book or go to the bamboo rodmaking sites to review the formula). I think the folks at H&H have a recommended guide placement chart for your blank (in their printed catalog) and on line, too. (By the way, you bought a nice blank.) Spine/spline: Bill B. gives solid advice here. Reviewing the FAQ and the archives on this site is also my recommendation. Best Regards, Vance

Thanks again all - I think I am all set. I was able to locate the spline on the top 3 sections. I'm going to use a guide placement I found and use the static placement instructions in the library to fine tune it.

Cliff, thanks for the input. I know this will not be my last rod so I decided to try to keep it relatively simple and on the inexpensive side. I wanted something I could get started in saltwater. Once I have a bit more experiance I'll put together a "real" salt rod.

Thanks all, I'm on my way.

Michael

Make sure you consult what the FAQs has to say about locating the spine on those stiff, short butt sections. That should help you as well.

..................

Michael. As a rule of thumb always place a guide on the female ferrule. You have to put a reinforcing wrap there anyway. Once you place a guide on the ferrule, the distance between the other guides more or less takes care of itself. Use the static distribution to fine tune. Ditto on the ceramics, especially on your heavier weight blank. You can use the inexpensive ones for your first rod. If you must use wire, go single foot and save half the work.

Michael,

I'm not sure this is what you are looking for, but Sage has a site that you can get measurements from. They use these on their production rods.

I have looked them up for you and this might get you into the ball park to start with. These are good for + or - 1/4 inch.

1. 3 9/16
2. 7 15/16
3. 13 3/16
4. 19 1/4
5. 27 1/4
6. 35 11/16
7. 44 11/16
8. 54 1/8
9. 65 7/16
10. 76 11/16

Hope this helps you.

Rick
RodsByRick

OOPS.

Can't get my fingers to work right. Can't even spell my own name

Rick
RodsByRick

Michael , you have made a good choice of blanks for your first rod , I've built 10-12 fly rods on H&H blanks . As for the guides , you should concider going to the incert single foot , as the others have suggested. The difference is like night and day . You already have two strippers , all you need to do is call Bob and order some guides to match , I'm sure he will be able to help you along .
If you do decide to use the snakes , it wont be long before you end up stripping them off for a re-wrap.........I think most of us have re-wrapped our first few rods more than once , that's part of the fun .
Good luck , it sounds like you've done your homework.
John