Does anyone give thought to wrap ends and beginnings or am I just being overly picky?
I have always taken steps to be sure the beginning and end of a wrap looks uniform, pleasing to the eye, and functional. Frequently these spots are the only areas that really stand out and I've felt they deserve a little extra attention, but I wonder if I'm just being overly picky. Things I watch out for:
1.  Be sure all ends or transitions are lined up on the bottom of the rod, usually opposite the guide ring.
2.  I normally only pull the thread under three wraps. I feel the thread finish will provide enough stability to anchor the wrap and this doesn't make a protrusive lump at either end of the wrap.
3.  I pull the thread ends before cutting so the thread is lined up with the blank. I've always thought this looks better than having the thread going off at a wild angle.
Curious what people think.

Guy Taylor
Lucerne Valley, CA

Little things add up to big differences. It takes not much more time to do the things you are doing and they combine for a more uniform and neat final product. Keep doing it.

............

I pull the tag end until it’s almost even with the end of the wrap, cut it and then pull it on through. That way there’s no tag end sticking up from the wrap.

Daryl Ferguson Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I pull the tag end until it’s almost even with
> the end of the wrap, cut it and then pull it on
> through. That way there’s no tag end sticking up
> from the wrap.

I've heard quite a lot about that method. Always using a sharp razor blade and some care I haven't found it necessary.
I go through a lot of razor blades.

I have been struggling with this for a few days. As I was typing out my problem I figured out what I was doing wrong. I have not been paying close attention to my pull through thread and I think its wrapping around my tag end when I pull it. This is causing the tag to be pulled through a lot more than it should be and ruining my wraps. I am trying to line up everything in each wrap but with that issue its been a struggle. I just grab scrap thread at hand for my pull throughs, I am starting to think there is a better way. What is everyone using? haha I'm sure that hasn't been asked before.

I never pull the tag end of the thread completely through the wrap. I insert the tie off loop earlier than most rod builders do. After inserting the tag end into the tie off loop, I pull the loop so it is tight against the wrap, and the tag end will just about stand up. I then cut the tag end with a pair of fine tipped scissors so it is flush against the wrap. When I pull the tie off loop out the tag end is hidden under the wrap with no nub or fuzzies to worry about. It also saves a lot of time, because you don’t have to go back and trim the tag, which is time consuming and a pain to do.
Norm



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 06/08/2023 05:14PM by Norman Miller.

Raymond Mckean Jr Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I have been struggling with this for a few days.
> As I was typing out my problem I figured out what
> I was doing wrong. I have not been paying close
> attention to my pull through thread and I think
> its wrapping around my tag end when I pull it.
> This is causing the tag to be pulled through a lot
> more than it should be and ruining my wraps. I am
> trying to line up everything in each wrap but with
> that issue its been a struggle. I just grab scrap
> thread at hand for my pull throughs, I am starting
> to think there is a better way. What is everyone
> using? haha I'm sure that hasn't been asked
> before.

Lots of people use scrap thread and it works great for them. I use a piece of 2# monofilament. It's not very strong so I replace it often but I feel that it slides in the thread well and I've got a whole spool of the stuff.

Guy Taylor
Lucerne Valley, CA

Norman Miller Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I never pull the tag end of the thread completely
> through the wrap. I insert the tie off loop
> earlier than most rod builders do. After inserting
> the tag end into the tie off loop, I pull the loop
> so it is tight against the wrap, and the tag end
> will just about stand up. I then cut the tag end
> with a pair of fine tipped scissors so it is flush
> against the wrap. When I pull the tie off loop out
> the tag end is hidden under the wrap with no nub
> or fuzzies to worry about. It also saves a lot of
> time, because you don’t have to go back and trim
> the tag, which is time consuming and a pain to
> do.

That's exactly what I do, but you explained it a little better than I did. lol
> Norm

Guy, - Raymond.

A couple of thoughts.

1. Lose the razor blade, and rather purchase a Dr. Slicks fly tying scissor and use that. I have used the same pair of scissors to snip thread, as I used when I first purchased a pair based on the advice of my rod wrapping teacher many many years ago. I sharpen the scissors ever several years.

2. For pull thread, forget about using wrapping thread, or using monofilament line. Rather use 10 lb power pro braided line. It is nice if you use a bright florescent line, to make the line more visible when it is dropped. Also, as you make your pull loops, add a nice bright pink bead at the knotted end of the tie loop. Also make your pull loops a nice generous size, so you are not handicapped by having too small a loop. The braided line has a very small diameter, is next to unbreakable and is very slick and pulls much easier through wrapped thread than any other type material for a pull loop. These beads, for example, make both great fish attractors and they also make a pull thread much much more visible. Also, the bead gives you something to grip as you pull a thread through a wrap.

Best wishes
Roger

2. For pull thread, forget about using wrapping thread, or using monofilament line. Rather use 10 lb power pro braided line. It is nice if you use a bright florescent line, to make the line more visible when it is dropped. Also, as you make your pull loops, add a nice bright pink bead at the knotted end of the tie loop. Also make your pull loops a nice generous size, so you are not handicapped by having too small a loop. The braided line has a very small diameter, is next to unbreakable and is very slick and pulls much easier through wrapped thread than any other type material for a pull loop. These beads, for example, make both great fish attractors and they also make a pull thread much much more visible. Also, the bead gives you something to grip as you pull a thread through a wrap.

Best wishes
Roger


I do the almost the same. I use un-coated white super braid and tie a very small bead on it to have something to grip. then After I snug the loop up against the thread, I cut it shorter than where the start of the loop and pull at an angle of about 45 degrees (Hypotenuse of the triangle is the longest side so the thread absolutely stays below the wrap. I do one additional thing, I un-braid if you will the thread so it lays a little flatter. I made a bunch of the pull throughs ahead of time so I will never run out since that braid is so durable.

I guess I'm going to have to find some braid.

Guy Taylor
Lucerne Valley, CA

I agree, braid makes the best thread pullers.
I tried posting these pictures yesterday to illustrate how I tie off thread wraps. A lot of other people do it the same way.

[www.rodbuilding.org]

[www.rodbuilding.org]

[www.rodbuilding.org]

[www.rodbuilding.org]

Norm



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 06/09/2023 06:41AM by Norman Miller.

I have tried both methods (what Norm described) and pulling thru and cutting thread end after. Have had success and failures with both methods. Still learning and I think as with most things practice makes perfect.

With the Norm suggested method I have cutoff pull thru thread too short and my wrap has come unraveled on a few occassions. Also, sometimes it is hard for me to get pull thru thread straight and the angled bump is more visible. Can't snug things up with this method but if you are good and tight before pulling thru shouldn't need to do further tigthening.

With the pull and trim after method I have had nubs/fuzzies that I then have to mess with and try and fix (either with flash of heat or by trimming nub after 1st coat of epoxy). I have also accidentially nicked my wrap when cutting off pull thru causing the wrap to unravel. I've tried razor blades and the scissors recommended by Roger Wilson. With the scissors I find it hard to get pull thru cut close enough to not have a nub/fuzzy showing thru. I do like that I can straighten up my pull thru and tighten things up when trimming after the fact.

Anyhow, still on the fence about which method I prefer. Going to continue testing out both methods and like I said earlier hoping that practice will make for better and more efficient wraps with additional experience.

Like several others have suggested I like using light braid for my pull thru loop. I definitely experienced a few thread breaks when pulling thru with regular D size thread.

I'm a believer in Norm's method and also in using braid for the loop ( may be a little too OCD but I also use DNA on the braid before using it the first time ). I'm wondering if it's just my old fingers but I feel an Xacto knife gives me better control than any razor blade .

I was going to make the point that Ronald made above ..... if you're using brand new braid right off the filler spool, make sure you clean it extremely well with alcohol or some other solvent, as some braided lines have a wax on them an it will leave a residue on the thread. Then there's the whole thing about them shedding color. Either clean it well enough that you've stripped off the majority of the dye, or use old braid that's been used on a fishing rod.

When you retie while fishing, just cut off a fairly long piece and save it for making tie off loops.

I used to use 50# braid for my tie off loop, but it made pulling through a little difficult with the kind of thread tension I use. I got some 15# braid from a buddy, and it makes pulling through a whole lot easier.

David Baylor Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> I was going to make the point that Ronald made
> above ..... if you're using brand new braid right
> off the filler spool, make sure you clean it
> extremely well with alcohol or some other solvent,
> as some braided lines have a wax on them an it
> will leave a residue on the thread. Then there's
> the whole thing about them shedding color. Either
> clean it well enough that you've stripped off the
> majority of the dye, or use old braid that's been
> used on a fishing rod.
>
> When you retie while fishing, just cut off a
> fairly long piece and save it for making tie off
> loops.
>
> I used to use 50# braid for my tie off loop, but
> it made pulling through a little difficult with
> the kind of thread tension I use. I got some 15#
> braid from a buddy, and it makes pulling through a
> whole lot easier.


Got a small spool of Plain white Cobalis super braid and no cleaning since not coated and never a contamination problem with any fish eyes in finish? Have you gotten fish eyes in your finish? What were you using for pull thrus, brand name.

Kerry, no, never any contamination problems such as fish eyes n such. But, I have never used brand new braid for a pull through loop.

I just know that some braids that I have tried in the past, had what seemed to be a waxy coating on them. And that colored braids definitely shed color when they're new. So since wrapping guides is my least favorite part of rod building, I'm just not going to take a chance of using anything that could potentially contaminate a wrap, and make me do it over.

As for what brand I am using for my pull through loop. I have no idea. I had a buddy cut off a length from one of his rods while we were fishing together. All I know is he told me it was 15# test. Couldn't even tell you what brand the 50# braid I was using, is. I took it off of one of my dad's old reels, and I now use it on a reel I use when doing static load guide placement. It's yellow and makes seeing the line really easy on my aging eyes.

David Baylor Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Kerry, no, never any contamination problems such
> as fish eyes n such. But, I have never used brand
> new braid for a pull through loop.
>
> I just know that some braids that I have tried in
> the past, had what seemed to be a waxy coating on
> them. And that colored braids definitely shed
> color when they're new. So since wrapping guides
> is my least favorite part of rod building, I'm
> just not going to take a chance of using anything
> that could potentially contaminate a wrap, and
> make me do it over.
>
> As for what brand I am using for my pull through
> loop. I have no idea. I had a buddy cut off a
> length from one of his rods while we were fishing
> together. All I know is he told me it was 15#
> test. Couldn't even tell you what brand the 50#
> braid I was using, is. I took it off of one of my
> dad's old reels, and I now use it on a reel I use
> when doing static load guide placement. It's
> yellow and makes seeing the line really easy on my
> aging eyes.


well what you are using has had a loty of handling so who knows what is on it. I told you what I use. Just buy a small spool of 10lb test un coated plain white Super Braid. That one spool will probably last you a life time and the cost is low. I will never use up my spool and from it I probably have 40 or 50 pre-tied with bead that will last my Grandson a life time without having to use from that spool. Do it right with no cheap short cuts and will pay off.

I use Glide floss for the pull string. Works great and no wax.

I like that Glide floss idea. Now that's quality graphite hygiene. Just pulled a few long threads through on some Forhan wraps with regular A thread and the pull got a little grippy a few times.