I've read and heard conflicting information. Is the thread treated with silicone, or some other lubricant? I've heard yes. I've heard no.

Thought I'd ask the experts on this forum.

Thanks

Yes it is Gary it's done to run in high speed embroidery machines sometimes you can be lucky & get away with not using cp .I use embroidery threads all the time but I use cp on every wrap.

Regards Baz

Bundeena
NSW Australia

Hi Gary,

Wrap a test stick and try to apply finish without being color sealed first. The finish will not stick and that usually implies silicon contamination.

They do have nice colors.

Capt Neil Faulkner

Gary as Barry said it is impregnated with silicon. If you don't put color preserver on it, it will almost disappear(as with most untreated thread)once you put epoxy on it. . Also while mixing your epoxy throw in a 1 1/2" to 2" piece of the Madeira thread. Some how it acclimates the epoxy to the thread when coating. This will prevent the "fish eyeing" this thread is known to do.
Tim

Gary,

I have called and talked with representatives of every commercially available embroidery thread in search of one that is not lubricated. I learned that all embroidery threads are lubricated. Some more than others. The thread is lubricated as part of the manufacturing process so it can pass through their spooling machinery at high speeds. Without lubrication the thread would be damaged at the high speeds they spool the thread.

None of the manufacturers have info to share on the specific thread lubricant they use or the amounts per spool, so there's no way to compare one brand vs another other than anecdotal reports from users. My limited experience working with Madeira is similar to what others have reported - the type and amount of lubricant used is easy to work with, just use a normal application of color preserver and you should not experience any kind of problems.

On a side note, there's been some anecdotal info passed among rod builders that you can some how "prepare" epoxy finish to work with lubricated thread by cutting a section of the thread and adding it to the epoxy just before mixing the epoxy. The idea is that somehow lubricant transfers from the thread into the epoxy as it's mixed and this makes the epoxy less likely to fisheye on a wrap. From a chemical engineering standpoint, this really makes no sense at all. The two compounds are not chemically compatible in any desirable way. What's really happening here is the epoxy has a natural level of tolerance to the lubricant. As long as the amount of lubricant on the thread does not exceed this compatibility threshold the epoxy will work as we would expect it to. Adding lubricant to the mix via a section of thread stirred in at the mixing time only raises the ratio of lubricant to the epoxy bringing it closer to the point where it will manifest as a fisheye during application or leveling out. So adding thread doesn't help in any way, but at the same time in most cases it doesn't really hurt either. Someone added thread and they didn't get a fisheye. That doesn't mean the thread prevented the problem, all it really means is it wouldn't have happened in the first place.

This kind of erroneous anecdotal reporting happens all the time. We'd like to believe it, but it's just not so. Like people saying it's "necessary" to add acetone to finish to get a level bubble-free finish, or adding Visine to finish can give a matte finish to the epoxy.

Try doing it It just may work in spite of what may be said about it not working

Ya never know unless ya try

Bill - willierods.com

Thanks for all the replies gents. And a tip o' the hat to Mr Powell for the detailed answer. I make very few comments on this site. Being new to this craft, I have little or nothing to add to any conversation. But, I always get good answer to questions I post. I've come to depend on this place for answers. You guys are the best.

I really like Fuji thread. I've had very good results using it, but the color selection is very limited. I have a couple of builds coming up which require colors not in the Fuji line. I've tried Prowrap thread, and had more fuzzy problems with it than with any other; maybe even more than with all others combined, so I'm staying away from that. I've come to believe that thread is like epoxy. You have to learn how to work with each variety for the best results, and I've learned how to work with Fuji thread.

Madiera has a lot of colors. That's why I asked. Looks like I'll need to learn to work with it.

To this point, I've never tried a wrap without CP, so I'm used to using it, and have learned how to work with Chromaseal.

Gary, you're on the right track.

Stick with Fuji...the colors will come...

I only commented about the thread trick as I know quite a few guys that use it and it seems to work. I have used it numerous times and I have never had a problem. And I say this as the other day I coated a rod wrapped with Madeira and in my absent mindness I did not put any thread in the finish and it fisheyed like crazy. I am no chemical expert, just passing along some info.