Getting ready to build a Daiwa Ballistic Saltiga 13' 3" 40-405 to be used with a Saltist 30 BG conventional reel. I cant find any information on potential layouts for this rod and was wondering if anyone had built one in the past and if so with what guides and what placement. Otherwise I'm planning on buying various components and just test casting different layouts.

I think your latter idea is going to work best for you. MIght as well dial it in yourself and know what you're getting up front.

Consider any shock leader knots when you select guide sizes.

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Here are a couple of general guide lines for a 2 piece conventional 13' surf rod:

First, establish the length of the handle. It is determined by your physical size, strength, and size of sinker + size of bait.
This should be another topic.

Your reel seat is then mounted down locking. If desired the reel could be attached to the rod with coasters for testing purposes.

The butt guide should be about 40 inches from the face of the reel. Try to land it on the ferrule. This will provide additional reinforcement of the ferrule. Additionallly, co-location of a guide with a ferrule will take some pressure off the ferrule when loading the blank.

The size of the butt guide is determined by the size of the reel. Generally, size 25 for JigMaster (or Daiwa 40) and smaller reels. Size 30 for larger reels. The guide size compensates for the height of the reel.

Many surf fishermen use a 10:1 ratio for determining their shockleader requirement. If their total payload is 5 ounces, the shockleader will be 50# line.
Tournament casters are required to use 0.75mm lockleaders when casting 5 ounces. 0.75mm generally equates to 80# line.
So, what you intend to cast weight wise will determine the strength of your shockleader, subsequently the size if the shockleader knot, and finally the size of your running guides and tiptop.
In short, I have found size 12 Fuji Alconites to be very good.

Recommended test set of guides:
Fuji Alconites. Today I prefer polished stainless.
1 ea MNAG30, 1 ea MNAG25, 2 ea MNAG20, 2 ea LNAG16, 4 ea LNAG12, 1 ea MNAT12-XX (tiptop)

My current process is to mount a reel. Do a static test layout. Remove the size 12 guides and in their place, replace the size 12 guides plus 1 additional size 12 (typically a total of 4). I have found that the added weight of 1 size 12 LNAG does not impact the addional response provided by that guide.

Well, that's a start. Please remember, the above is only a general process. Your adaptation and refinement will be required.

Hope this helps,
Don

Don Becker



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 11/10/2014 02:38PM by Donald Becker.

Interesting read Don, thanks for the post.

I just got finished building a couple ballistics. One with low riders for casting, one with K frames for spinning. Doing a static test. the low riders, I used 2 on the mid section, and then followed out to the tip using size 10 "running" guides. Good info Don gave you, your best bet will be to static test it for placement and test cast like you were saying. For the stripper, I used the curve of the blank and test casting to determine the best position. The reason I chose 10's out was because this was going to be used with a 525mag, 17lb line with a 60lb shocker. The spinner, I used 10's as well. I was told braid was going to be used, but there was a chance of 17lb with 60lb shocker.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 11/10/2014 04:10PM by Robert Hudak.

Guys, a surf road is on my projects 'pipeline' :) Where do you source the Ballistic blanks ? sorry for hijacking the thread Nathan!

Don,

The info you have provided is extremely helpful and I have been debating back and forth between using the MNAG/LNAG's or using the TLCSG Lowriders and putting them on upside down as the rod is going to be strictly for casting, not spinning. After seeing what has been suggested I believe I am going to spend some time at the local park and just static cast and dial everything in. I believe that based on my physical build the reel seat is going to be placed 28 inches from the butt of the rod, I've experimented with 30 and its almost uncomfortable and a bit of a stretch. Now from what I have come to understand by looking at the blank and reading some stuff online the ferrules are actually a flexing ferrule so if I place a guide on the ferrule do you think it is going to affect the loading of the rod?

Robert,

As of now I am leaning towards using the Lowriders as I have spent some time casting a friends ballistic that has them on it already. He used them so that he could use either spinning or casting reels on the rod but I am looking at strictly casting. As of now I believe the line is going to strictly be 20lb mono with probably 40-60 pound shock leader. As of now I'm looking at doing roughly 8 guides (maybe more depends on static tests) plus the tip with a layout of probably 20/16/12/12/10/10/10/10 to start out but I will buy various extra eyes and will probably end up changing the layout. Overall the rod is going to be use primarily for Cobia/Drum in South Nags Head but 90% of the time in Hatteras.

Alistair,

It sounds crazy but I actually got the blank from Amazon and saved about 160 bucks from the retail price of the blank. I wasn't looking at buying a blank this early in the process of learning about all of the build but for the price I couldn't pass it up, especially when I had casted the same blank multiple times a few days before finding it. I have a Daiwa product catalog that shows all the blanks in it so I know you can get them directly from Daiwa but I was able to find the blank here [www.tackledirect.com] but it does ship directly from Daiwa.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 11/11/2014 01:47PM by Nathan Elswick.

You should select the size, height, and position of your most important guide - the stripper - with the diameter of your reel spool and in relation to the alignment of the stripper guide to the axis of the reel spool. These are basics. The greater the stiffness of the line being used the more that distance, diameter, and height of guides influences casting performance - which is what surf rods are about.

You should select the size, height, and position of your most important guide - the stripper - with the diameter of your reel spool and in relation to the alignment of the stripper guide to the axis of the reel spool. These are basics. The greater the stiffness of the line being used the more that distance, diameter, and height of guides influences casting performance - which is what surf rods are about.

Nathan

If it's for a conventional reel then there is no point in using low riders, they are really designed for spinning reels.

28" is a good butt length although you may find it a little short with the heavier leads so I'd suggest 30" to the middle of the reel may be better. Best way is to tuck the bottom of the rod butt in your armpit, extend your arm fully and grab hold of your rod butt, stick out your thumb and that is where the reel goes although you can add an inch or two if you want.

As to guides you will find that MNAG's in 30,25,20,16,12,12,10,10 and a 10 tip is all you will need and the leader knots will go through them with no problems. You can change the 10's to 12's if you want but I've never found the need myself.

As to spacings try this: 4,9,15,22,31,43,58,76 - all in inches from the tip.Tape the guides on, put a reel on the rod and the line through the guides, tie the line to a post or whatever and flex the rod into a quarter circle. The line should not touch the blank between the guides so you may have to move a few of them to get a nice even curve in the line. If you are struggling to get it right add another 10 or 12 guide.

Hope this helps.

Tim