Hi,
I am new to rodbuilding, and would like to ask can anyone offer any advice on how to correctly epoxy a larger area than a guide wrap?. I am coating a decal and can't seem to get a level finish down the length of the decal. I seem to get ripples running around the circumference of the blank. I think these are forming during the drying process, as it seems OK during application. I am using flexcoat and have tried regular and lite build, but am getting the same effect on each.
Thanks for any advice or suggestions
Nigel

Ripples = Too much finish. Get some piece of practice blank and work on technique. Use less epoxy AND do it with a fresh batch.

Jim Gamble Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Ripples = Too much finish. Get some piece of
> practice blank and work on technique. Use less
> epoxy AND do it with a fresh batch.

2X

I've found that less is more when applying rod finish. Several thin coats will yield better appearance, at least when I did it. Others will chime in and have other ideas on this topic. Change it up and practice until you find a technique that works for you.

Chester

May your line be tight and your beverages be cold!

OK thanks guys, I suspected this but wasn't convinced as a second one I tried while deliberately using less epoxy yielded a similar result! Anyway thanks for the advice, I will persevere.

Use CP on the decal. Occasionally there will be release agents on the decal that repel epoxy and cause an uneven surface that you may be seeing as "ripples".

I'm no expert on this (still a newbe) but when I was having the same problem I was told the temp in my finish area was to low and both the epoxy and the room needs to be over 70* F.

If you are tuning the rod on a drier try this . Apply the finish to the area and make sure there are no dry spots. Leave the rod set until you see sags on the finish at the button. Take something with a straight edge (old credit card or the fake ones they send in the mail as a promo) and remove the excess finish. Rotate the rod 180 degrees. Fill in any dry spots you see with a dab of finish. Let it sit again until it sags. Remove the sag and rotate the rod . By now all the excess should be removed and the finish should level nicely. Some times a little heat is needed to get it to lay out flatter but usually not. Now put it in the drier. also make sure the drier is not turning too fast trying o sling the finish off.

Freddwhy (Rapt-Ryte)

I don't believe that temp is an issue, and am thinking that the last post and removing the excess after allowing it to fall to the bottom of the blank is what I will try. Now the only question is whether to remove the decal and start again or whether to try and fix the problem via applying a second coat? I am interested to in the comment about applying CP to the decal and will definitely try that on the next one I do from scratch. I had definitely only applied CP to the decorative wraps at either end of the decal.

It will be difficult to get a level finish when the sub-strait isn't smooth (ripple free). You could try to smooth the finish first with gentle sanding, but be careful not to go too far.

Chester

May your line be tight and your beverages be cold!

I really struggled with this starting out as well. I agree with Fred. On the longer area I have started applying finish length wise, no around the blank. I coat this area first then the rest of the rod and as Fred suggests stop the rod and let everything sag, rotate a couple of times. Then turn on the dryer as normal and let dry. You might notice that it will help get a better (less) finish on the guide fee.

I've had decals recently repel finish and push the finish away leaving low spots. Happened on 2 decals. A 2nd coat cleared up the issue one of them but the other was over a long area and made my finish unlevel.

Given I apply finish the same way every time I apply finish I am certain it was something in the ink of the decal or on the decal itself.

Adam did you have CP on the decal? One of the earlier. Posts suggested that this would address the problem?

I've never applied CP on decals. Havent had issues before. It was just these latest two batches of decals I received that had issue. Decals before them have been no problem.

Nigel if you applied the same batch of finish to your guide wraps and dried them at the same time then it would point to the decal being your problem.

if you didn't then it could be a number of things, including the finish going off too quick,dryer spinning too slow, drying in too low a temp, rod bouncing in the dryer etc etc etc

so try and eliminate the variables to pinpoint the cause.

Try the secount coat and do what Fred suggests as long as the edges of the decal did not Lift up
You may need a third coat

Bill - willierods.com

Nigel, I too have terrible troubles over the Peel N Stick decals we are all using these days. I found that a mat finish spray (I think its called Krylon in the USA - not sue about the UK) works pretty well.
Thin (ish) coats and use Tom's 180 degree rotation technique for the first 40-50 minutes and you should solve your problem. It have worked well for me. I never had this issue with waterslide decals I might add.
Good luck. Let us know how you go.

I ask regarding the posts about removing the excess. Why is there an excess. If you are getting sags, sure, you're applying too much finish.

I have had similar problems, but mine were associated with applying the finish unevenly. I've solved it by concentrating on applying the finish with the brush moving axially along the blank much more than it moves circumferencially along the blank, if you get what I mean. I mean that I concentrate on moving the finish along the blank axially.

Regarding temp, my problems have been when I applied too much heat with an air heater gun. I used to get really ripply surfaces when I got the finish too hot. Now I just apply the gun for a few seconds to bust the bubbles, but not enough to really heat the finish and make it very low viscosity. Sorry I can't be more definitive, but I think you have to experiment with your process and work it out in your terms so that it works for you.

But , there are a few things that have to be right: longitudinal technique in apply ing finish, especially if you, like I, don't have a fast blank turning device (the faster turning devices make it easier to apply finish evenly), be very careful of applying too much heat, better to use multiple thin coats than trying to do it in one coat.

Well thank you all for the substantial responses and advice. As you will know I am new to this forum and I am awed by the volume and level of detail you have all contributed to helping me resolve my problem.

I have two rods now with one coat on the decal on one and two coats on the other. While not perfect the rod with two coats looks considerably better than the one with only one, so I am going to persevere with these two rods and build up to 3 coats each. However I am interested with the views on using longitudinal (down the blank) strokes to apply finish with the rod stationary, and will try this on the second and third coats . Interestingly, I have never seen the sagging that some of you describe, even when using an alcohol burner to dissipate bubbles, so feel that I certainly dont have an overly excessive amount of finish applied. Interestingly the guide wrap coats came out perfectly, these were done at the same time or at least in the same manner as the decal coats. As an aside, can I ask if it is required to put a second coat on the guide wraps in the case that the first coat looks perfect? BTW I am using my dining room as my workshop, so believe the central heating is giving me an ideal working temperature!

Finally, and at risk of getting ridiculed by you experts (go easy on me here), I probably should have shared a small detail on the decals that I don't believe has any bearing on the problem, but I will share anyway. I have used gold leaf (via a process known as gilding in art circles) as a base underneath the decals. This was primarily purely artistic, as it allowed me to print my decals onto clear waterslide decal paper (the graphic image of our logo has a certain amount of black and grey in it), and this allows the image to show up nicely which it wouldn't do against a black or grey blank. It sounds a little gaudy, however in the context of an overall theme of gold and black (black wraps with gold trim bands) and gold trims on the reel seats etc I think it will look fantastic if I can just get the finish right!

Anyway thanks again for all of your input, I will let you know how I get on and post a picture of the finished article if I get it half decent!

I do the long stroks with a brush Lightly After the finish is laid onto the area I go ( with rod turning ) from left to right about 3/4's of the area several times then repeat right to left Wait several seconds and see if it levels out Usually does

Bill - willierods.com

Your gold leaf shouldn't be a problem, however your labels are definitely the issue.

As previously stated a couple of times above, either the label glue is exposed around the edges, and there is some release agent on the label itself. Both of these will repel finish and it won't be consistent from label to label. If you want a consistent result you must seal the label prior to using any finish coats. CP works but plan on using a couple of coats. I've had better luck with Krylon workable fixative (also often used by artists on drawings). 2 coats with an hour wait time between coats usually works great.

When applying finish I use exactly the same method as Fred does above with really good results, often in just one coat. You might try practicing your finish technique on a scrap of blank with no labels.

Terry

Terry's Custom Rods