I've built from a few kits so far but haven't put together all the pieces myself yet. I've had a st croix SC5 blank come my way (5S66MLF) and I am going to put together a rod for myself with it.

It seems like I'm able to locate all of the pieces I need, but I'm having trouble sizing up the tip top. The specs for this blank show the tip size as "4". Is this referring to the width of the blank at the tip, or is it saying you should get a guide that has a size 4 circle?

When I was looking around for tip tops at mudhole.com, I see that their tip top sizes show as something like 4.5(4) ~ 1.6mm tube. What do these numbers all refer to?


I went ahead and bought a tip top with those specs... 4.5(4) ~ 1.6mm tube since i was placing an order already. The one I got was [www.mudhole.com]. I got it because I was guessing the (4) in parentheses was what corresponded with the blank's "4" in the tip size. It fits on my blank nicely but the diameter of the ring seems small. I have a retail-bought St Croix Premier PS66MLF2 rod, which I would assume is built up with similar dimensions, and the ring of the tip-top on this rod is much bigger than the one I bought-- so I'm worried I got the wrong tip top here.

I think there's just too many numbers flying around for me to nail them down, can someone help me out?



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 08/09/2012 11:20AM by Scott Degen.

The target specs are just that, but the process for making rod blanks means that such specs as tip sizing may be off by at least a hair, if not more.

When you see "4" listed as the tip size, that refers to a target spec of 4/64ths inch diameter for the blanks tip diameter. You may find, however, that your blank's actual tip size may be a little closer to 3-1/2 or 4-1/2 64ths. Whenever you can afford it, you should order the listed size plus perhaps one the next size larger. Or, have your supplier fit a tiptop to it when ordering the blank. If you have the blank on hand, you can measure it yourself and then order what you need.

.................

The tip you bought is a 4.5 ring size and will match up with size 4 guides. I use this size tip on most all my builds. I recently built a rod similar to that and used a DF8, SF5, and the rest are SF4's. Great blank! I have found that the best guide spacing for nearly every rod I do begins with- 4in from tip, then 4 1/4, 4 1/2, 4 3/4, 5, 5 1/2. At this point you need to flex the blank to determine if you can jump up a full inch or just a 1/2 in. Butt guide would fall roughly 21in from reel.

When you see something like 4.5(4) you are looking at a tiptop with a mounting tube ID of 4.5/64ths and a ring diameter (outside to outside of the ceramic) of 4mms.

.............

Scott,
If you don't have one of these tools, get one.

[www.mudhole.com]

This tool quickly and easily measures both the outside of the blank tip, as well as the inside of the potential tip size.

You can also use a caliper to make the measurements, but this little tool is so quick and easy to use.

As Tom pointed out - you will measure the tip for a given size in 64th of an inch sizes.
Then, you will specify the size of the ring that is on the tip itself.

Be safe
Roger

Tom, do you have that backwards?

If the blank specs indicate a size 4 (or4.5, 6 etc)it refers to the tube size, measured in 64ths of an inch. They never list a ring size as that is decided by the builder

Mike (Southgate, MI)
If I don't want to, I don't have to and nobody can make me (except my wife) cuz I'm RETIRED!!



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 08/09/2012 03:37PM by Mike Barkley.

So a 4.5(4) means a 4.5 tube a size 4 ring?

Tom is correct.

Adam Curtis Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> So a 4.5(4) means a 4.5 tube a size 4 ring?

No 4.5 ring on a 4 tube.

Maybe I am reading what he is saying and confused.

But the guy bought a 4.5(4) from mudhole. Looking at mudholes tiptops I would believe he bought a 4.5 ring with a size 4 tube.

What confirms this - besides all the tops I've ordered fitting is that a 5.5(5) shows a 2mm tube as well as a 7(5) also shows a 2mm tube. If the tube was the first number wouldnt a 5.5 and 7 have different mm sizes?

[www.mudhole.com]

Not trying to be confrontational, I'm just confused now.

I don't understand Thatcher you mean
As stated earlier à 4.5(4) is 4.5mm ring with a 4 tube (so 1.6mm tube or of you'd rather like a 4/64 inch tube)

5.5(5) and 7(5) as you list are 5.5mm and 7mm ring both on 2mm tube (5/64 inch).

Tom wrote this

"When you see something like 4.5(4) you are looking at a tiptop with a mounting tube ID of 4.5/64ths and a ring diameter (outside to outside of the ceramic) of 4mms." -

I might be reading it wrong but isnt he is saying 4.5 is the tube and 4 is the ring.

I asked if he had that backwards and 2 people said he was correct.

Result - confused.

I'd have to go back in and look at the particular manufacturer, I may indeed have it backwards depending who's product you're talking about. When you look at the listings, you should one number remains constant across a spread of secondary numbers. The secondary numbers, the ones that change in half sizes, are the ones that indicate the tube ID.

................

Scott, The tip you have is a 4.5 ring and a 4 tube size. I use a lot of these tips. I'd also order a 4.5 tube size for that blank. Sometimes the paint on the SC blanks may be thicker.

Wow, thanks for all the replies everybody.

So some of you said that you would use a tip this size on my rod blank. i'm curious why? What's the advantage to using a smaller ring like this on the tip?

It's a spinning rod that I'm building, not sure if that was known. I'm worried that the way the line moves around so much in the guides might not work right with such a small ring, but I don't really know what I'm talking about with this stuff. :)

Check out that Anglers resource video on the KR concept. Size 4 guides will be fine, but you will likely need a high frame 20, High frame 16 and a low frame 10. I just built a spinning rod with this guide set up.

Brandon, that video is pretty interesting. I think in the near future I'm going to try that methodology out and see how it works. I don't currenly own any rods like this so it'd be interesting to see how this compares with my current rods.

However, with this build being a really high-end blank, I'm not going to be doing any experimentation this time-- I'm planning on using the St Croix recommended guide placement, just to be safe here. Is there a tip top that anybody would recommend for this? Like I mentioned before, the 4 tube size seemed to fit really well here.

Thanks so much for all the help so far!

If your worried about that then go buy some cheap blanks and practice the KR concept and static guide placement, you'll kick yourself for not using it on a nice blank like that once you learn it. I don't like using "canned" guide placement because every rod blank even of the same model will vary slightly due to the manufacturing process. I just started building this past May, and I have built 3 rods out of the SC5 blanks now, all with Kr concept, just do your research, tape your guides first and ALWAYS test cast. I even went as far as taking my first rod out on the boat taped up an fishing with it, just to make sure it was how I wanted it. I usually end up with 20-12-5.5-4-4-4-4 for guides

Don't follow St. Croix's chart. You can do so much better. Try the article in the library.

Russ in Hollywood, FL.