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Choking point location finding and measuring method.
Posted by: carol staiculescu (109.99.52.---)
Date: June 07, 2012 06:47AM

For many people that proved to be a tricky business . So I’ve made a short tutorial with the method I use to find the choking point location on a blank (or fishing rod) .
Because we are talking about measuring you’re supposed to have one fishing rod and the reel he will be equipped with. When I say “fishing rod” I’m thinking at least at a blank with the handle part and reel seat mounted (preferably without the fore grip mounted ) .
there is the theory:
when a stick touches the table in only one point , there can be an angle , but when the stick touches the table in 2 ore more points there can be no angle . An angle made by the stick with the table means a deviation of the stick trajectory and for our measurement that means a bad result.
In our case instead of a stick will be the reel axle which should make no angle with the table edge . In fact it is best if the axle touches the table edge with all his surface .
In the picture below you can see the correct contact between the reel axle and a table edge.
[www.rodbuilding.org]

In the 2 pictures below you can see how an incorrect contact between the reel axle and a table edge should look like.
[www.rodbuilding.org]
[www.rodbuilding.org]


So if I press the reel axle firmly against the table edge (with the reel mounted on the rod ) then the reel will pull the blank to the intersection point (choking point).
In the picture you can see the choking point:
[www.rodbuilding.org]
In that moment you will mark the choking point on the blank and the reel axle tip projection on the blank (using a set square tool). After that you will simply measure the distance between the two marked points.
[www.rodbuilding.org]
It is best that 2 people will do this measurement together because, while one is keeping the reel axle in firm contact with the table edge (together with all the reel-rod assemble) the other one can position himself in such way then he can view the intersection point perpendicularly from above to be able to make a correct marking. He will then also be marking the reel axle tip projection on the blank (which is a perpendicular line drawn from reel axel tip to the fishing rod –that line length is known as the “spool height” in GPS -).
If you are alone (without anybody to help you) and you have a 7 feet or shorter rod there is a trick you can use. It was my friend and partner rod builder genial solution to my problem of measuring when alone. You can do the measurement on a door’s edge. It will however give you an error in the range of an inch or less because you cannot position yourself in such way that your eyes to be at the same level with the intersection point (so you can eyeball it in a perpendicularly manner). Since we are not building airplanes that kind of an error I consider acceptable (especially if you’re in a hurry).
What you need to do is position the reel axle in a firm contact with the doors edge. Then with one hand you will keep the reel-rod assemble in place only by pressing the reel axle against the door edge with your thumb. With your other hand you can grab the rod form the intersection (choking) point and then mark it . The reel axle tip projection on the rod you can do it afterwards on the table’s edge as I’ve explained before . In the end you just measure the distance between the 2 marked points on the rod. It’s that simple .
[www.rodbuilding.org]
[www.rodbuilding.org]
[www.rodbuilding.org]

kingofbeasts custom rods



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 06/07/2012 07:32AM by carol staiculescu.

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Re: Choking point location finding and measuring method.
Posted by: bill boettcher (---.dyn.optonline.net)
Date: June 07, 2012 07:46AM

make it easy like Toms article is in the Library Page

LAY THE ROD on the table YOU ARE MAKING IT WAY TO COMPLICATED !!

You will CONFUSE many newbies

Bill - willierods.com

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Re: Choking point location finding and measuring method.
Posted by: carol staiculescu (109.99.52.---)
Date: June 07, 2012 07:58AM

The short version is this:

carol staiculescu Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------

> Press the reel axle firmly against the
> table edge (with the reel mounted on the rod )
> then the reel will pull the blank to the
> intersection point (choking point).
> In the picture you can see the choking point:
> [www.rodbuilding.org]
> In that moment you will mark the choking point on
> the blank (point C) and the reel axle tip projection on
> the blank point B (using a set square tool). After that
> you will simply measure the distance between the
> two marked points.
[www.rodbuilding.org]
BC lenght will be you choking point measurement on the blank.

kingofbeasts custom rods



Edited 3 time(s). Last edit at 06/07/2012 08:03AM by carol staiculescu.

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Re: Choking point location finding and measuring method.
Posted by: Phil Ewanicki (---.res.bhn.net)
Date: June 07, 2012 08:40AM

What is the benefit to finding the choking point?

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Re: Choking point location finding and measuring method.
Posted by: bill boettcher (---.dyn.optonline.net)
Date: June 07, 2012 08:54AM

The chock guide is the smallest guide possible and from there the runners are the same

Less weight on the tip --better performance The best performance the blank will have is with no guides so as you lay guides on you add weight The blank has to Carry this weight - slows it down Keep it light

Bill - willierods.com

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Re: Choking point location finding and measuring method.
Posted by: Jim Ising (---.dyn.centurytel.net)
Date: June 07, 2012 10:22AM

Looks like a solid method to me. GPS is nothing more than a way to automate what Tom, Carol and many others have done for many years to determine guide position for New Guide Concept builds.

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Re: Choking point location finding and measuring method.
Posted by: Lou Auret (204.16.161.---)
Date: June 07, 2012 11:15AM

An old fly rod top section/s of about 6 or 7ft works too if put on the spindle of the reel, push it to one side of the blank and it makes a natural X marks the spot.
Problem with all these methods is most times i don't get to have the reel, just its spool diameter or the rod is used with a few different reel sizes with different lines on them .
So i have to use another method like 27x

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Re: Choking point location finding and measuring method.
Posted by: carol staiculescu (109.99.52.---)
Date: June 07, 2012 01:12PM

Phil Ewanicki Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> What is the benefit to finding the choking point?


it is best explained here:
[www.rodbuilding.org]

kingofbeasts custom rods

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Re: Choking point location finding and measuring method.
Posted by: Phil Ewanicki (---.res.bhn.net)
Date: June 07, 2012 04:23PM

The "choke guide" is still mumbo-jumbo to me. Will the placement of the "choke guide" improve casting distance or accuracy, and if so how much? I sometimes pair a rod with a different reel and frequently replace my line with a different type or brand. Will this significantly harm the performance of a rod because the choke guide placement should altered, along with the placement of the whole guide train? Is the placing of a choke guide the same for casting rods, spinning rods, and fly rods, and if not, why not?

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Re: Choking point location finding and measuring method.
Posted by: bill boettcher (---.dyn.optonline.net)
Date: June 07, 2012 05:02PM

Phil

Try it That is all I can say
Watch the line coming off the reel on a spinning reel The whole idea is to make the line go STRAIGHT as soon as possible Casting reels the line comes off the reel in a straight line also with fly lines

Check out the article in the library page and try it

You have a nice day now

Bill - willierods.com



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 06/07/2012 05:13PM by bill boettcher.

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Re: Choking point location finding and measuring method.
Posted by: Tom Kirkman (Moderator)
Date: June 07, 2012 05:08PM

Phil,

Read this to better answer your questions:

[www.rodbuilding.org]

Changing reels that are only slightly different in size will not alter the casting performance to any noticeable degree.

................

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Re: Choking point location finding and measuring method.
Posted by: Russell Brunt (---.mia.bellsouth.net)
Date: June 07, 2012 05:35PM

For those of us paying attention to all the wrong things.......is that a Dam Quick. Been many a year and looks have changed a bit....but wow I think it is.

If so, are they still the quality they were 40 years ago?

Russ in Hollywood, FL.

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Re: Choking point location finding and measuring method.
Posted by: Tom Kirkman (Moderator)
Date: June 07, 2012 06:03PM

Russ,

Most of the D.A.M. reels are now made in the orient and are the same reels sold by just about everyone else. They recently re-introduced the Champion line, built in Germany, but I haven't been able to find one locally. I'm sure they're expensive due to the amount of machining required to build one of those. They still feature the reverse worm gear drive from the looks of things.

..............

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Re: Choking point location finding and measuring method.
Posted by: carol staiculescu (109.99.52.---)
Date: June 07, 2012 06:19PM

Russell Brunt Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> For those of us paying attention to all the wrong
> things.......is that a Dam Quick. Been many a
> year and looks have changed a bit....but wow I
> think it is.
>
> If so, are they still the quality they were 40
> years ago?

Yes it is. They are not quite as they use to be but are still high quality products. Or, maybe, in present, we are abusing the reels more than in the past .Of course, nowadays you have much more good quality products to compare it with than 40 years ago. Anyway, i'm guessing that my grandchildren will have it still functioning. All i know for sure is that I'm using it from several years now without any problem.

kingofbeasts custom rods



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 06/07/2012 06:25PM by carol staiculescu.

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Re: Choking point location finding and measuring method.
Posted by: bill boettcher (---.dyn.optonline.net)
Date: June 07, 2012 06:32PM

Carol

I can not understand why you put and hold the rod to check the Chuck the way you do

You are holding the rod - off -- the table and putting the spool spindle on the table edge

Why ??

if the rod is laid onto the table - or any flat surface - and the spindle of the spool is aliened with the edge Your hands are - free - to place guides on

Bill - willierods.com

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Re: Choking point location finding and measuring method.
Posted by: carol staiculescu (109.99.52.---)
Date: June 07, 2012 06:35PM

Phil Ewanicki Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> The "choke guide" is still mumbo-jumbo to me. Will
> the placement of the "choke guide" improve casting
> distance or accuracy, and if so how much?
>...................
Yes it will improve the reel-rod combo performances. How much each of those who are making tests will notice (it depends upon many factors to be considered ). If it matters ? i'm guessing that each of us will decide for himself. For my self i can only say that if i have to chose between a "questionable better" and a sure "no " i'll go for the " questionable better" (if he can be real at least in theory).

kingofbeasts custom rods



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 06/07/2012 07:06PM by carol staiculescu.

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Re: Choking point location finding and measuring method.
Posted by: bill boettcher (---.dyn.optonline.net)
Date: June 07, 2012 06:42PM

it sure as @#$%& beets the - cone of flight - way to do it

Bill - willierods.com

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Re: Choking point location finding and measuring method.
Posted by: Phil Ewanicki (---.res.bhn.net)
Date: June 07, 2012 06:44PM

When I fly cast the fly line enters the guide train from a much sharper angle than line enters the guide train on a spinning rod. I am interested in improving the distance and accuracy of my fly casting, and if positioning fly guides by determining the choke point will make an appreciable difference I'm going to rebuild all my fly rods. Should I use the same method of positioning as you recommend for spinning rods? I may also rebuild the guide train on several of my casting rods with which I employ reels with a spool that is approximately the same width as the diameter of a comparable spinning reel.

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Re: Choking point location finding and measuring method.
Posted by: carol staiculescu (109.99.52.---)
Date: June 07, 2012 06:50PM

bill boettcher Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Carol
>
> I can not understand why you put and hold the rod
> to check the Chuck the way you do
>
> You are holding the rod - off -- the table and
> putting the spool spindle on the table edge
>
> Why ??
>
> if the rod is laid onto the table - or any flat
> surface - and the spindle of the spool is aliened
> with the edge Your hands are - free - to place
> guides on

What i've did is to be able to measure the Choking point with the smallest possible error. if I lay reel-rod combo on the table i will have to position the spindle paralel with the table edge by eyeballing from above and there is room for error. If I pres the spindel in firm contact with the table's edge he cannot move in such manner to give me an angle deviation so my spindle can only be paralel with the edge (and in the same time will pull the rod directly to the intersection point). More, if I lay the combo on the table the reel body will make it impossible for me to create a contact between the spindle and the table (in such way that the spindle will touch the table along he's entire lenght )
i won't put the guides directly for the simple reason they are yet to be established and ordered. I must first buy them so i can use them (and i don't like buying more than i need ).

kingofbeasts custom rods



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 06/07/2012 06:56PM by carol staiculescu.

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Re: Choking point location finding and measuring method.
Posted by: bill boettcher (---.dyn.optonline.net)
Date: June 07, 2012 06:52PM

On a fly or a casting rod the line - does not enter the first guide -- IN PIG TAILS

Think about it -- Those - Pig tails - have to be smoothed out and go straight to the tip Better distance

Bill - willierods.com

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