So I finished building a chuck to use with my power wrapper. Any hints or advice as to specifics when making the bed etc. I plan on using some extruded aluminum to make the bed which should be good to clamp the rest of the parts too.

What is an ideal centerline when measuring from the bed to the center of the rod/chuck. Any thoughts on a good bed length????

I wont be building fly rods so we are talking probably a max of 7 foot 1 piece rods

[www.rodbuilding.org]

[www.rodbuilding.org]

Casey,
I have built several different power wrappers.
To answer your question very simply - it is really up to you with respect to the dimensions.
The dimensions are dependent on your rod building style as well as what you are comfortable with.
When you build, do you have the thread on the backside of the rod, or on the front side of the rod. What height do you want the rod to be above your wrapper base.
Do you wrap sitting down or standing up. Do you sit on a chair or sit on a stool..

How long a space do you have to place your power wrapper.
Do you want to stay in one place and have the power wrapper roll by you, or do you want the wrapper to stay in one place and then have yourself move up and down the rod when you wrap.

What sort of rod rests are you going to use to hold the rod when wrapping. Depending on the sort of rod rests that you are going to use, and the style mounting base for the rod rests, you might want the centerline of the rod rests to be on the center of the wrapper base, or you might want the centerline of the wrapper base to be offset.

--------
One of the wrapper bases was made from a 1x4 with the centerline offset so that the mounting line for the rod rests was one inch from the front and 3 1/2 inches from the back of the base. This base was used primarily for ice rods and was only 4 feet long.
Another base was made of a 1x8 with the centerline running down the center of the 7 1/2 inch base width. IN this case, I was using rod rests that that had an equal spacing from front to back and thus mounted in the center of the wrapper base. This base was 10 feet long.

My current wrapper base is made from a U shaped piece of aluminum channel that is 4 inches wide - 10 feet long and 3/16th thick material. Since my current rod rests use a cantilevered base, the centerline for the base has been offset, so that it is 1 inch from the front side and 3 inches from the back side.

I also have a skate board bearing mounted on each side of each end of the wrapper base. This allows me to sit in the center of my rod building bench and then roll the rod by my work station. That way, I don't have to move tools and or wrapper controls up and down the rod. I stay put, and let the rod tip, and each guide, and base wrap roll past my work station. It is much easier to move the rod, than it is to move myself and the associated wrapper foot pedal, controls, tools and thread.

I like to use DC gear motors to drive the wrapper chucks. This allows me to have excellent speed control, reversible direction, and the correct speed, with no added reduction belts or pulleys. I use a foot pedal for speed control and have a reversing switch on the power supply that is positioned directly behind the rod for easy reach.

Summary -
Determine your particular wrapping needs. Determine the type of thread holders that you are going to use and where you are going to have them located. Determine or construct the rod rests before you build your wrapper bed. You need the bed to accommodate and be integrated as part of the wrapper base. The way that you wrap, and the way that the rod rests are designed will determine where the centerline needs to be on your wrapper base.

Good wrapping.

Roger

Well my problem is that I havent built a rod in 15 years.... When I did build a few I was using a dryer that was assembled from the guts of a can opener my mom gave me and a couple other odds n ends. I was roughly 15 at the time... I still use those rods to this day...

Now at 33 im a little more high tech LOL.... I have a frequency drive which gives me infinite adjustability of my motor speeds and have darn near a machine shop in my garage to build whatever...

I guess I need to get more of the parts before I decide on specs. I have yet to purchase the aluminum to build the base nor even thought about the rod rests. I didnt think much about them as I figured they would be easy to machine but I guess thats kinda putting the cart before the horse.

I love your thoughts on having the entire contraption roll side to side... I had not thought about that but it could make for a very user friendly machine... I will do some thinking :)

If you look under my name and my pictures you can see mine. I used an old aluminum frame from a storm door. I took the frame pieces and spaced them 1/4" apart with 3/4" wood feet underneath so that a 1/4" carriage bolt would lock underneath to hold my roller supports. I like to weave so I set my rod support height at 6" above my base for the minimum and I can go up higher if needed. I now have some different supports made completely from aluminum that I got from one of our sponsors to the left and I really like them (Okie Rodbuilding). I tried to make it where everything was adjustable: supports-up, down, left and right: tensioner-in, out and side to side etc. Here's one picture: Also be sure and look at the photo page under equipment because there are some really great wrappers in there.

[www.rodbuilding.org]

David Dosser
Coshocton, OH

Casey; these are the stands I built for my homemade lathe. Alum came from 8020 Garage Sale site. not many power tools all cut by hand

[www.rodbuilding.org]

[www.rodbuilding.org]

[www.rodbuilding.org]

This rod wrapper by Kevin Holt has always been of interest.

[www.rodbuilding.org]

Chris Richer
Iroquois ON

Barry Thomas Sr Wrote:
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> Casey; these are the stands I built for my
> homemade lathe. Alum came from 8020 Garage Sale
> site. not many power tools all cut by hand
>
> [www.rodbuilding.org]
> /photo/6565/title/another-view/cat/all
>
> [www.rodbuilding.org]
> /photo/6563/title/new-jig/cat/508
>
> [www.rodbuilding.org]
> /photo/6564/title/roller-stand/cat/508

Nice roller stands Barry.

David Dosser
Coshocton, OH

for you guys using a low speed gear motor "rotisserie" on your power wrapper for drying how are you attaching it. The shaft on these motors dont turn unless its powered. So it cant free spin when the other power wrapping motor is used ??? Are you disengaging the gear motor when wrapping or using some sort of clutch etc.

Thanks

Casey,
I use my power wrapper all of the time for drying if, I am only building a single rod in the day.

Otherwise, I use the power wrapper to apply the finish and then move the rod over to the drum dryer for the final drying.

I have a variable speed dc gear motor on my motor that is foot pedal controlled and may either be spring return control, or fixed setting control.

So, if I am using the fixed setting foot pedal, I can set the power wrapper to turn - in either direction at any speed from 0 to 1000 rpm.

I generally apply finish at speeds up to about 100 rpm and then slow down to about 6-10 rpm for drying.

The dc motor has the advantage of continuous variable speed, that may run in either direction.

Roger

Yeah I like using the variable DC motors and controls out of treadmills for power tools. People think im nuts when they see the guts out of one laying out front for the garbage guys. They work great in my band saw, lathe, and drill press. You cant get crazy power out of them but for smaller power tools they are great.

For this wrapper I have a frequency drive that I can adjust the speed of this little AC motor. I was more curious just because I see some wrappers have 2 motors ( 1 for speed and 1 for drying ) It looks like they are both connected with a belt which doesnt make sense to me. Maybe they are using some clutch or something that I cant see

Casey,
For the wrappers that use the two motors, they typically use two stretch rubber belts. But, only one belt is used at a time.
When the wrapper is being used, the belt from the high speed motor is connected to the chuck drive pulley and the dryer belt is disconnected. When the dryer is being used, the belt from the low speed motor is connected to the chuck drive pulley and the high speed belt disconnected.

Very simple.

That is why most of the common wrappers that use the standard 5000 rpm ac series wound motor have a series of pulleys and belts to get the drive rpm down to the appropriate speed for use on the wrapper.

Roger



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 09/22/2011 07:20PM by roger wilson.

Casey,
Remember, for a power wrapper, you need to be able to have your chuck speed adjust from 0 to ?? .
One of the most important parts of the power wrapper is the transition of the wrapper chuck from 0 to 1, 2, 3,4 and 5 rpm. Many wraps are done at this slow speed. This is especially true when working with complex wraps etc.

I was under the impression that an ac frequency drive motor could vary the operating speed over a fairly large range, but I was not aware that a frequency drive could take the speed of the motor down to 0.

Roger

p.s.
For the DC gear motors that I have been currently using on my wrappers; I use an adjustable voltage power supply. I can adjust the voltage from 0 to 30 volts. The gear motors still have plenty of power even at 1/2 volt for a good starting torque on the power wrapper.
The power supply is controlled by a variable resistor that is in the foot pedal. When designing a power supply for this application, it is imperitive that the power supply will go to 0 with the control turned all of the way down.
There are many inexpensive solid state regulators on the market that will take the voltage down to .5 volts and then on up. However, this .5 volts on one of the low voltage DC gear motors will allow the wrapper motor to creep and are unsuitable for wrapper use.

On the ones you see with 2 motors, one for wrapping and one for drying, they remove the belt from the wrapper motor and attach it to the dryer motor. If they want to hand wrap (free wheel) the just remove the belt from the pulley and the chuck will free wheel.

David Dosser
Coshocton, OH

Yeah a frequency drive is adjustable from 0v-130v or 0hz to 60hz. Actually the ones I have convert single to 3 phase but im not using all 3 phases for my purpose. So you can go from a full stop to whatever RPM its capable of. Plus I adapt a foot peddle to it as well as have several preset speeds.

Now im not saying there would be any torque at say 1hz but ive overcome that by gearing it down with a couple pullys and belts. The DC motors definitely have an advantage at the low end for torque.

So im still confused as to how someone has the low speed dryer / gear motor connected to the shaft at the same time the wrapper motor is also connected. I understand they dont have to both be powered at the same time but the low speed dryer motor would be a gear motor. Which means the shaft will not turn freely when its power has been shut off. It locks up due to the gear reduction.

So how can someone have both a high speed motor and low speed gear motor connected at the same time. Is there a way to lessen the tension on the dryer motor so its not engaged until needed ???? Almost like the belt setup on a garden tiller. Or are they using an electro-clutch. Or am I just missing something

They aren't connected at the same time. If you look at a PacBay power wrapper you will see that the chuck is connected to the power wrapper motor with a belt. You have to physically move the belt to the dryer motor in order to dry with it. If the belt is left off either, it free wheels. They both use the same chuck with one belt, just different pulleys for the wrapper and the dryer. Does that help?

David Dosser
Coshocton, OH

Yep that makes perfect sense....

A couple different power wrapper power units using DC 30 volt gear motors:

[www.rodbuilding.org]

Roger

What are those DC gear motors out of ?????? Never seen any like that

On another note what position do most of you guys like your thread carriages / tension devices in. I plan to build a platform which will keep the spools behind the rod being wrapped as usual. My question is do you like the thread spool above or below the rod being wrapped. I have been looking at some of the units they sell at Pac bay and it seems most are below the rod. My first thoughts are that I would want it behind the rod but higher as it would be easier to access. Then I build a handle which reaches under the base so I can slide it left and right without reaching over or across the rod being wrapped.. Yeah its hard to describe without pics...

If you look at mine I have my thread carriage behind the rod. The spools are a few inches up from the base. The thread runs through an eyelet then up through a spring steel wire with a loop or a tip top on it, then to the rod. I also have it to where if I want to, I can run the thread from the spring wire to an eyelet below and in front of the rod which slides the length of the wrapper on a round aluminum bar (3/8"). The one in front has a nylon spacer/washer about 7/16" thick with an eyelet screwed into it. I use that set up when I weave mostly. Usually I have my tension carriage as far back as it will go (probably 12" or maybe a little longer) and run the thread up through the reverse tension rod (spring steel rod) and then it comes toward me over the top of the rod. Here's an updated picture. I got my dc motor off of the big @#$%& site. It is a Pittman 0-25v and runs top speed about 300 rpms. I basically had a lot of help from Roger Wilson on mine and I love it. The motor is tiny, has plenty of torque and is quiet. You just have to find a dc foot pedal or variable control and a converter box.

[www.rodbuilding.org]
[www.rodbuilding.org]

David Dosser
Coshocton, OH

Okay I think I get most of that however what is with the spring wire and tip top ?????? It seems that its only purpose is to raise the height of the thread. Why not just make the spool carriage higher ????? What am I missing as im sure there is something.


The DC motor setups i a great idea and actually has me rethinking mine... but I already had the stuff laying around so we shall see.